"Wanna have a catch?" ... Baseball in the 80s

Thank the maker that Major League Baseball is about to start. I'm not sure I can handle any more televised basketball or hockey. And I've watched "Top Gun" so many times lately that even my TV remote has lost that lovin' feeling and thinks Maverick is dangerous.

But until that first pitch on opening day goes flying past somebody's noggin, we can derive a little preseason excitement from the baseball movies of the '80s, which not coincidentally is the subject of next week's podcast.

Times pop music critic Sean Daly and sports columnist Tom Jones will join the show to decide once and for all: Which was the best baseball movie of the 80s?

Which one would you pick? Here are some pros and cons:

THE NATURAL (1984)
Balls: Beautifully scored, featuring sublime performances by Robert Redford, Darren McGavin, Kim Bassinger, Wilford Brimley ("Don't you know I hate losin' to the Pirates?!?").
Strikes: Seeing Redford play an 18-year-old version of himself is creepy. And other story lines seem a bit hooky at times.
Favorite quote: "I guess some mistakes you never stop paying for."

BULL DURHAM (1988)
Balls: Considered the most realistic movie made about the minor leagues (how many others can you name?); perhaps Kevin Costner's single-best film performance.
Strikes: Watching Tim Robbins pretend to be pitcher is painful; and listening to the never-ending, thick North Carolina accents is like taking a Nolan Ryan fastball to the forehead. (Note to Hollywood: I'd prefer the fastball next time. It'd ease my pain.)
Favorite quote: "The rose goes in the front, big guy."

FIELD OF DREAMS (1989)
Balls: Possibly the most quotable baseball movie of all time and featuring the best speech about baseball every conceived -- delivered by the always brilliant James Earl Jones ("It reminds of us of all that once was good and it could be again.")
Strikes: Is it really a baseball movie? Or just an excuse to see if every male you know cries like a baby at the ending? (Just say, "Dad ... wanna have a catch?" and here come the waterworks.)
Favorite quote: "Hey rookie! You were good."

EIGHT MEN OUT (1988)
Balls: Great ensemble cast featuring John Cusack as the tortured Bucky Weaver.
Strikes: Difficult storyline to follow unless you're already familiar with the 1919 World Series. Christopher Lloyd channels "Rev. Jim" from "Taxi" for his turn as "Bill Burns."
Favorite quote: "Those guys are all gone now."

MAJOR LEAGUE (1989)
Balls: Easily the funniest of the group, thanks to Bob Uecker ("Just a bit outside"), James Gammon as manager "Lou Brown" and "Wild Thing" Charlie Sheen.
Strikes: The Cleveland Indians as winners? Only in Hollywood.
Favorite quote: "Yo, bartender, Jobu needs a refill."

So what's your pick? We'll read the best comments during the podcast.

Comments

[Brett]

of the ones you listed, I'd rank them in this order:

Major League, just because it's so damned funny.
Eight Men Out, because I read the book and the movie was a faithful adaptation of it.
Bull Durham, realistic and hysterical
Field of Dreams, loses points for making Shoeless Joe lefthanded
The Natural, decent movie, hokie ending.

[Marissa]

Baseball been berry berry good to me.

"Eight Men Out" is currently On-Demand for free. I'll have to watch it again. I haven't seen it since I first rented it long, long ago. Strange considering its Cusack factor.

I know baseball as well as I could trek my way up Mt. Everest with a ball of twine and red stilettos.

That being said, I have watched "Bull Durham" and "Major League" the most. Always remember, "Up your butt, Jobu!" works for many situations.

I will admit to being drawn in to "Field of Dreams" because, damn it, I love James Earl Jones.

[jane]

My favorite baseball quote comes from the wise and sage Mr. Berra: Baseball is 90% mental -- the other half is physical.

Gotta go with Bull Durham at the top of the list. It brings the laughs. It brings the sexy (“...I believe in long, slow, deep, soft, wet kisses that last three days.”) And it brings the Church of Baseball. Agree that Costner’s on his acting game in this one, but I’d put it alongside his work in “The Upside of Anger” (as, ironically, a former major leaguer) as his best film performance. It’s also fun to watch Susan Sarandon and Tim Robbins, as this is the film on which they met.

Field of Dreams. I’ve watched it. I appreciate it, although not to the level of some (maybe it’s a chick thing.) But... JEJ’s speech always makes me want to head for the ball park (Al Lang, preferably), grab a scorecard, a cold Bud and a hot dog so I can prop my feet up on the seat in front of me, pull my ball cap down over my eyes and enjoy an afternoon of bliss. It reinforces for me that baseball is and always will be America’s truest pastime. At least for me.

Major League -- sheer laughability. Uecker kills me.

The Natural -- love the mythical aspect of it. And cannot forget Glenn Close’s work in it: “You know, I believe we have two lives. The life we learn with and the life we live with after that.”

Eight Men Out. Shamefully, I’ve never seen it all the way through, so it’s last only by default.

[Bassnote]

I'd rank them in this order:

1. Major League - just too funny.
2. Bull Durham - also funny, but Costner is not a convincing baseball player.
3. Eight Men Out - good Bio-Pic.
4. The Natural - decent movie, goofy ending.
5. Field Of Dreams - I just don't love this movie like other people, and it's not really about baseball.

[Rock_Vbrg]

"Bull Durham" is probably my favorite out of the bunch. There were times, when I was coaching my son's little league team, that I had to resist channeling Coach Riggins ("Ya lollygag onto the field. Ya lollygag off the field...") Everything I learned about coaching techniques and the game I learned from him ("It's a simple game. You thrown the ball. You hit the ball. You catch the ball."). Man I love that movie.

"Major League" and "Field of Dreams" are tied for second depending on my mood.

I have not watched the others so I can't comment on them. But I knew that baseball was around the corner when SportSouth had "Bull Durham" on. An sure enough as soon as it went off there was a Atlanta Braves Spring Training game!

[chad]

well field of dreams is my favorite movie of all time(nothing to do with baseball). all the guys out there will understand. kevin costner is also my favorite actor. i know he gets ragged on a good bit these days, but can anyone look at his body of work and not be impressed(untouchables, silverado, no way out, dances with wolves, jfk, the bodyguard, bull durham, field of dreams, wyatt earp, waterworld, tin cup, mr brooks, the upside of anger, for love of the game, etc.). so i guess my rankings would be: 1. field of dreams 2. bull durham 3. major league 4. eight men out 5. the natural(although ive never seen it in my entire life, just bits and pieces)

[Spears]

I think "The Natural" might be the most overrated of the bunch.

And don't forget the dark horse: "The Slugger's Wife."

[chase]

Whoa, no love for The Slugger's Wife? Rebecca DeMornay?? Naw, me neither.

But The Naked Gun could classify, maybe, Leslie Nielsen as an ump? Funny stuff.

What about Costner in 1982's Chasing Dreams?

And 1987's Trading Hearts? Raul Julia anyone?

And I vote we grandfather in the Gary Coleman classic, 1979's The Kid from Left Field ... :-)

Red Sox win, 6-5 in extra innings. The season's on!

[Walter Cox]

"Get a hit, Crash"
"Shut up"

And I occasionally use the line, "When you speak of me, speak well"

[Spears]

Don't forget "Brewster's Millions" as well.

[Walter Cox]

For "The Natural", I really like the shot of Wilford Brimley in the darkened dugout with the sparks reflecting off his glasses.

I wouldn't mind having a voice like James Gammon when I'm an old codger.

[Rick]

I'm ba-a-a-ck!

Not like anyone missed me, but let's just say I'm thankful that whoever has been overseeing the TampaBay site had made a change somewhere: they'd added some kind of bug which caused my web browser to crash as soon as this site and a pop-up loaded. But as of today (fingers crossed), no crash.

Okay, so nobody missed me. Well, for what it's worth, THE NATURAL is my all-time favorite baseball movie, followed by FIELD OF DREAMS which isn't really a baseball movie anyway; it's GHOST between a father and son.

[Marissa]

Rick, I've missed you. :)

[Johnny B. Goode]

Excellent choices all, although I must admit I don't get as much out of "Field of Dreams" as most other folks seem to.

My choice is "Bull Durham." From the bar scene with Crash and Meat after Meat gets called up to the Show, the movie takes on a whole other dimension.

But the quote you reference from "Eight Men Out," which John Cusack delivered at the end of the movie, is probably the best line in a baseball movie, ever.

[Rick]

Aw, Marissa you da bess!

[Rick]

Okay, back in the fray...

Here's why BULL DURHAM stinks: in a romantic comedy you need to have two people (even three) that your audience will root for and whom can be considered desirable...

Bug-eyed, skanky Susan Sarandon is about as desirable as a Pekingese with a yeast infection.

The very idea that Costner's character would fall for this diseased barfly is too dysfunctional to applaud. From the get-go the characters are way too skeevy and syphillitic, but it would've helped if someone earthy & ballsy like Debra Winger or ethereal like Michelle Pfeiffer had played Annie Savoy. Sometimes casting is everything.

[Former Producer Dave]

For me, it's always "The Natural" in spite of the contrived "goofy" ending. A close second is "Field of Dreams"....not a dry eye in the house when he meets his father. "Major League" is such a classic comedy, too. Great list, Steve, and I'm looking forward to the podcast!

[Former Producer Dave]

Hmmmm, let me guess Rick.....not a Sarandon fan? ;)

[Debra]

Out of all those I rank "Bull Durham" and "Major League" at the top (I have always preferred comedies).

You spoke of the painful pitching by Tim Robbins. On the opposite end of the spectrum was Charlie Sheen's pitching in Major League (since he had experience in high school) - I think I read they clocked his delivery at 80-85 mph.

One of my favorite scenes in "Major League" was when Wesley Snipes woke up in his bed (I guess in the parking lot) and says "$#!%...I've been cut already?!"

And Steve - you also spoke of the NC accent in "Bull Durham" - I haved lived in Eastern NC for 12 years (after living in Clearwater for 25 years)...I get to hear it day-in and day-out. English is a foreign language to many North Carolinians!

[Sherrie]

Bull Durham is the top 80's baseball movie, no doubt about it. Annie Savoy was just that, a baseball Annie (groupie), but I don't think that's any reason to assume that Crash Davis couldn't have realistically fallen for her. She's no skanky barfly, she's a Zen mama with a taste for gifted young ballplayers. In the midst of my second favorite quote (after the "long, slow, deep kisses" quote of Crash's) from Bull Durham, she says "Sometimes when I've got a ballplayer alone, I'll just read Emily Dickinson or Walt Whitman to him, and the guys are so sweet, they always stay and listen. 'Course, a guy'll listen to anything if he thinks it's foreplay." Love, love, love Bull Durham. I worked in a movie theater when Bull Durham came out, and I still have a half dozen sets of promo baseball cards of the actors from the movie that we gave out with a large popcorn or somesuch thing. (and I sold popcorn to Howie Mandel when he came to see Bull Durham before a show at Ruth Eckerd Hall way back then- I bet I gave him some promo cards.)
Second- Major League is a great one, though it pales in comparison to Bull Durham
Third- Field of Dreams- a good one, but really only periferially about baseball so that knocks it down a few.
The Natural and Eight Men Out never really appealed to me, though I've seen both more than once. So, in summary to a long and rambling comment, Bull Durham is the ultimate 80's baseball movie, end of story.

[aces88ss]

Brewster's Millions...not a great movie, but passes the Sunday afternoon TV flipping channels test...I would stop.

The Natural (read this with a bit of a snobby Brittish accent), the book was so much better than the movie. But Wilford Brimley as the coach! Whatever lines he had were the best in the film. Unless I happen to flip while Brimley's talking, I wouldn't stop.

Same with Eight Men Out.

But, Bull Durham and Major League not only pass the flip test, they make me mad that i didn't check the listings to see them from the beginning.

OK, Field of Dreams...Let me share. I grew up in Peoria, Illinois. Almost exactly half way between the Chicago Cubs (Whoo Whoo) and the St. Louis cardinals (Boo). My sainted father, once each year would load me and one of my friends into the car and drive us to see a Cub/Cardinal game...DURING THE SCHOOL YEAR! Yeap, my dad not only took me to a MLB game every year, but also let me skip school to do it. Baseball and Fathers...come on.

And now, I am going to take the rest of the day off and watch the best baseball movie from the 80's, and then call my mother.

[jane]

aces88ss, it's so funny you said that. I just made a date with my dad to go to the last spring training game here in St. Pete on Friday. There is something about baseball and fathers -- even if you're a daughter.

Sherrie -- "Zen mama." Perfect description.

[aces88ss]

Brewster's Millions...not a great movie, but passes the Sunday afternoon TV flipping channels test...I would stop.

The Natural (read this with a bit of a snobby Brittish accent), the book was so much better than the movie. But Wilford Brimley as the coach! Whatever lines he had were the best in the film. Unless I happen to flip while Brimley's talking, I wouldn't stop.

Same with Eight Men Out.

But, Bull Durham and Major League not only pass the flip test, they make me mad that i didn't check the listings to see them from the beginning.

OK, Field of Dreams...Let me share. I grew up in Peoria, Illinois. Almost exactly half way between the Chicago Cubs (Whoo Whoo) and the St. Louis cardinals (Boo). My sainted father, once each year would load me and one of my friends into the car and drive us to see a Cub/Cardinal game...DURING THE SCHOOL YEAR! Yeap, my dad not only took me to a MLB game every year, but also let me skip school to do it. Baseball and Fathers...come on.

And now, I am going to take the rest of the day off and watch the best baseball movie from the 80's, and then call my mother.

[aces88ss]

Brewster's Millions...not a great movie, but passes the Sunday afternoon TV flipping channels test...I would stop.

The Natural (read this with a bit of a snobby Brittish accent), the book was so much better than the movie. But Wilford Brimley as the coach! Whatever lines he had were the best in the film. Unless I happen to flip while Brimley's talking, I wouldn't stop.

Same with Eight Men Out.

But, Bull Durham and Major League not only pass the flip test, they make me mad that i didn't check the listings to see them from the beginning.

OK, Field of Dreams...Let me share. I grew up in Peoria, Illinois. Almost exactly half way between the Chicago Cubs (Whoo Whoo) and the St. Louis cardinals (Boo). My sainted father, once each year would load me and one of my friends into the car and drive us to see a Cub/Cardinal game...DURING THE SCHOOL YEAR! Yeap, my dad not only took me to a MLB game every year, but also let me skip school to do it. Baseball and Fathers...come on.

And now, I am going to take the rest of the day off and watch the best baseball movie from the 80's, and then call my mother.

[Jeff in Cuba]

My ranking would go:

1. Field of Dreams
2. Natural
3. Bull Durham
4. Eight Men Out
5. Major League

The more compelling discussion isn't which of these movies is the best, but why is baseball far and away the most cinematic sport? Other sports have rivaled or surpassed baseball as "The National Pastime", but few (if any) football or basketball movies can match the movies on this list (which is only a 10-year sample).

Possible reasons:

Pacing - A baseball game can play out at whatever tempo the movie requires. The action can be authentic without being so frenzied that you can't follow it.

Action - Because baseball is a series of individual actions, it it easy to focus on the acheivment of individual characters while still maintaining the integrity of the game. There's nothing worse than a basketball or hockey movie where the featured character goes from end-to-end to make the winning shot, while their teammates are reduced to cheerleaders.

Athleticism - Although not necessarily the case today, for the most part, anyone can look like a baseball player. No need to be 7-feet tall, weigh 300 pounds or have a sculpted physique.

History - No other sport has tendrils that reach so far back into our nation's history. The day Custer was fighting at Little Bighorn, the Cubs were fighting for the National League pennant.

[DoctorDrew]

Glad to see the love for The Natural. Although, the movie is a weak stand-in for the book. The best book about baseball ever. There can be no discussion on that matter.

That being said, I would rank them thusly:
1. Field of Dreams. "You know we just don't recognize the most significant moments of our lives while they're happening. Back then I thought, well, there'll be other days. I didn't realize that that was the only day."

2. Bull Durham - What Rick said and it is truly painful to watch Tim Robbins pitch. Quotable though. "I want to give him the heat and announce my presence with authority!"

3. Major League - just plain funny. "Jesus, I like him very much, but he no help with curveball."
"You trying to say Jesus Christ can't hit a curveball?"

4. The Natural - Although the book ending would be too depressing for Hollywood, it fits the story better. I have always argued the worst mistake they made was getting Redford to play Hobbs.

5. Eight Men Out - The movie is incomprehensible to non-baseball people. Who are these people and what do they have to do with the story? Screenplay screwed up what was a wonderful film from an artistic and dramatic view.

[Vinnie]

I have to put Major League as the top one.
All were great in their own genre, but I will turn off alot of stuff to watch Major League, including some of the other movies listed in this blog

[Eric62]

Thanks, Chase. The whole Enrico Pallacio scene in the Naked Gun is one of my top 5 wacky scenes in all of filmdom.

[DoctorDrew]

Jeff,

I am intrigued by your arguemnts but I would counter that it is boxing movies are the best sports related genre.

These films bring us death, depression, imprisonment and ultimately...victory!

And boxing are the only sports movies to win an Oscar for Best Picture and it happened twice.

Which two?

[Rick]

Oh, I'm sorry, Sherrie...

What I meant to write was "well-read skanky Zen mama barfly."

But I think you brought up perhaps the most implausible aspect of her back story which precedes the implausible hookup with Crash -- that young athletes would be lining up to tuck their cleats under Annie's bed. Now, that is a laugh!

I think more realistically Annie's time would have been devoted primarily to finding a Chinese herbal remedy for the itching. ;-)

[jane]

DoctorDrew.

Rocky (1976)
Million Dollar Baby (2004)

Raging Bull, which should have won in '80, lost to Ordinary People.

[dj]

Of the great films listed, I would have to select Bull Durham as my favorite. Full disclosure -- I grew up in NC and my sister was actually in attendance during one of the nights that they filmed at the DAP (Durham Athletic Park). According to her, it was very chilly and they had to remove their coats for every crowd shot.

A 1980's baseball film which you did not mention is Blue Skies Again. Like The Slugger's Wife and Trading Hearts, it really doesn't merit more than a mention. (I do admit that I did have purchase it and Slugger's Wife on VHS.)

There was also a very short-lived TV series about baseball called "Bay City Blues". Although it was created by the Steven Bochco of LA Law fame, it didn't make a dent. The only thing notable was that Sharon Stone was in the cast.

[Rick in Scottsdale]

Dr Drew, I do believe t'was ROCKY and MILLION DOLLAR BABY that both won Best Picture.

[Jeff in Cuba]

DocD,

Point well taken. I'll reshape my argument to the fact that baseball is hands down the best TEAM sport when it comes to moving pictures.

[VineyardWoman]

If I had to pick just ONE of these movies it would be Major League. I know most of it by heart, and use many of the lines often. Marissa's right: "Up your butt, Jobu" comes in handy in numerous social (and not so social) situations. :-)

[DoctorDrew]

Hi jane,

I think OP is unfairly attacked. True, it has not stood the test of time and no one talks about OP changing the course of cinema, but think back to 1980. Jimmy Carter, Iran hostages, pretty bleak times . . .

In this context, OP had to win. Also, looking back historically, Raging Bull was not without it's detractors at the time - notably Andrew Sarris and Pauline Kael - 2 influential critics.

While I agree Bull should have won, the error was not as egregious as "How Green Was my Valley"'s win.

[jane]

I agree with you about OP being unfairly attacked, DoctorDrew. I actually liked the film a lot, dark as it is -- MTM playing against type and Tim Hutton's performance. It was one of the first films I saw as a young adult that really made me think and stayed with me long after I'd left the theatre.

And NO kidding about How Green Was My Valley... what were the Academy voters thinking.

Rosebud.

[Big Tex]

For proper sequencing, you should watch "Eight Men Out" then "Field of Dreams." But my favorite is Bull Durham: when I started my first "real" job in 1989, the secretary tossed me keys and said "Welcome to The Show."

[doogster34]

I think you are missing one of the best baseball movies of the 80's " Long Gone" starring a young William Peterson, Virginia Madsen and Dermot Mulroney. It was an HBO movie but doesn't feel like one. It has some of the best one liners. It has elements of all the movies on your list except field of dreams. If you like baseball movies it is a must see. And as a bonus Teller from Penn&Teller is in it and has a fairly large speaking role.

[Clark]

I like "Field Of Dreams" and "Major League" about the same in that I'll watch them any time I catch them on tv. Bonus points to "Major League" if for no other reason than the heroic, climactic play in The Big Game was such a surprise.

I liked "8 Men Out" but always thought of it as more of a story about a moral and ethical dilemma that happens to take place in baseball.

"The Natural" was great right up until they totally ignored the ending from the book.

"Bull Durham" is probably the best all-around movie of all of these. However, at the risk of incurring the wrath of the "Bull Durham" fans: Groupies with radar guns? A guy in his mid to late 30's playing class A ball in the Carolina League? Tim Robbins as a phenom pitching prospect? Sorry, it's a nice, well-told story but nowhere close to an accurate portrayal of minor league baseball.

[J.L.]

Even though it is just a comedy, Major League still manages to give me chills.

'get me Ricky Vaughn'
'You want Vaughn?'
'I got a feelin' he's due'

Sensational.
The indians win it! the indians win it! oh my God the indians win it!

[daniel clark]

61 about Maris & Mantle is really quite good.