Bucs cut Troupe to make room for Stevens

The Bucs released tight end Ben Troupe to make room for the return of Jerramy Stevens.

Troupe, a former second-round pick by the Titans, signed with the Bucs as a free agent. But he saw little playing time behind Alex Smith and John Gilmore.

Stevens ws activated from the reserve/suspended list. He served a two-game suspension stemming from his DUI convcition in 2007.

Troupe had no receptions in two games with the Bucs. He is not subject to waivers and immediately will become a free agent. The balance of his $605,000 is guaranteed.

Comments

[Jake]

Another top notch free agent acquisition of the Allen braintrust! Sure glad we got him instead of Alge Crumpler.

Bad Move!!!! Someone else will pick him up.....Troupe is a great player...just need someone to give him a chance.

Jake, you speak the truth!

[Pete]

Troupe showed nothing in camp. He was paid the minimum.......He was a stop gap.

[Jay]

I know Troupe wasn't a key figure here, but I didn't know Tampa was Miami "U"!

Way to sink a little lower Jon. How long ago was your Super Bowl win?

[BILL H]

EVERYONE IS BUSTIN' JG & BA RIGHT NOW...WHAT IF IT TURNS OUT TO BE THE RIGHT CHOICE? WHAT IF STEVENS HAS A GOOD YEAR AND MAKES IMPACT PLAYS LIKE LAST YEAR? YOU WILL BE BACK ON THE WAGON: AS ALWAYS

[BILL H]

CRUMPLER? HAVE WE EVEN HEARD HIS NAME THIS YEAR YET. UUUUUUM---- >NO...THANK GOD WE DIDN'T GET HIM AND HIS BAD KNEES

[BILL H]

AND FURTHER MORE NO PRAISE FOR THE GILMORE P/U OR IS THAT GIVE TO MUCH CREDIT FOR YOU PEOPLE?

[DMS]

Good riddance to another crappy Gator reciever/ tight end.

Ike Hilliard seems to be the only worthy pro pass catcher from that college. (Darrell Jackson, too)

(Go Vols)

[DR]

Troupe said he is going to assault 3 women in ybor tonight and drive home drunk with a goal of getting pulled over with a .03+ BAC so he can get resigned by the Bucs tomorrow. Look out Stevens, he's going to break your record and take your job.

[Tom]

Gruden haters are a bunch of clowns. What about picking up Warrick Dunn? What about Jeff Faine? What about John Gilmore?

Troupe was far from top notch. He was given a shot and didn't work out. Faine is top notch and he's doing great.

Why don't you Gruden haters root for another team? It's getting old.

[Pete]

Agree Tom.....these guys are the same ones that listen to the fat boy on radio bashing everything Gruden and Allen!

[BuccanBobby]

Rick...once again, beating all other feeds to the market with the Troupe news. As a Buc fan, I'm always checking for the latest...thx. For the money, Troupe was a "can't go wrong---stop gap, pickup". If he exceeded expectations--great, if not let him go when Stevens returned. Good call by Mgmt.

And to the DR., go elsewhere with your pathetic DRibble!

[Steve]

Seriously Tom and Pete. These are the same people who are shouting bench Galloway b/c he has taken over a game yet. Does this mean that if they were Chargers fans they would have been demanding last year that LT be benched in favor of Michael Turner because he had 130 something yards in the first two games. Or now Darrien Sproles should start over LT, heck Matt Forte is nearly twice the player because he has averaged nearly twice the yards. Go hate on another team and wait more than two weeks to make predictions about the entire season

[GrudenHater]

GrudenHater here (and I hate Allen too!)

Hey GrudenLovers, I like Faine and Dunn signings as much as you do. What you lovers won't point out are GruAllen screwups such as Derrick Deese, Matt Stinchcomb, Charlie Garner, Todd Steussie, Luke Petitgout. Bucs are still a mediocre team with Faine and Dunn. So I will continue doubt GruAllen until I see a super bowl contender. You lovers are gonna counter with a Griese argument?

If you want more, I can point out all their QB mistakes and draft mistakes too.

[Feesh]

Hey DMS - 59-20!

Still hurts, doesn't it?

[Steve]

GrudenHater,

I'm not saying the Buc's have not made some poor FA signings, but so does every team, it's just we notice these more because this is a team we follow much more closely. Secondly you should only expect picks 1-4 to turn out as contributors, 5-7 picks that turn out that way is just a bonus. First several years the Buc's did not have a full list of picks, especially early ones. Also in the last 4 drafts we have gained 8 starters not counting Caddy. Plus Sabby and Aquib who are on the feild a ton. Thats 11 guys, half a starting roster....must have been some horrible drafting.

[DR]

Steve, you have no argument. I'm still in shock. You compared Galloway to LT!? You are f'n out of your mind.
Sorry Azz kissers, but coaches are judged by record, and Gruden's record is not good. Talk about division championships and nobody who knows the NFL cares. There has been no other coach with a mediocre record like Gruden's that has had a tenure as long as Gruden. You look at the years Gruden has made the playoffs, and he only beats teams that are average. Gruden can't beat the better teams in the league and his formula of bringing in old vet QBs and others doesn't work. The Bucs have drafted well on the defensive side, but the offensive side has been a failure. You guys dog Clayton the most and he was Gruden pick who hasn't progressed.

[Tom]

Gruden Hater,

No one here is saying Gruden/Allen are spectacular. They have made some glaring mistakes and coached some very poor games. But, Gruden Haters don't look at things objectively and will cut our team every chance they can get.

Yeah, we have QB issues. How many teams don't have QB issues? We've made mistakes in free agency. Who hasn't? We've had bad picks and some stellar ones. Just like every other team. Yeah, we picked up Troupe for minimum. But the Titans drafted him the 40th overall. What's worse?

I'm tired of hearing the same old song from bandwagon fans. Most of which are from emotionally driven fans that know very little football.

[Tom]

Another bonehead comment by DR.

"but coaches are judged by record, and Gruden's record is not good"

Wade Philips Post-season record
0-4

Jon Gruden Post-season record
5-4 with a shiny Lombardi trophy

Wade Philips couldn't hold Gruden's jock strap.

[bobbyd]

Jerramy Stevens has not been convicted of any crime. Move along and get over yourselves.

As for the moron-haters who don't understand the first thing about football, I encourage you again to go perform the same draft/free agent evaluation of any NFL team and find the same thing occurs throughout the league. Some draft picks are good, some are bad. Some FA pickups are good, some are bad.

Ben Troupe cost us virtually nothing, so exactly how was it bad? We gave him a shot to see if he would exceed expectations and he didn't. End of story.

[bobbyd]

Thanks steve and tom for actually adding something valuable and intelligent to the conversation.

[skp]

yes let's jump all over management because a guy signed for the league minimum didn't work out.

and it has nothing to do with them uncovering another gem of a Free Agent in John Gilmore

[DR]

Tom,
Barry Switzer Post Season Record
4-1 with a shiny Lombardi
Brian Billick Post Season Record
5-3 witha shiny Lombardi

Barry Switzer Regular Season Record
45-26 .625 with Cowboys
Brian Billick Regular Season Record
80-64 .556 with Ravens
Jon Gruden Regular Season Record
38-26 .593 with Raiders
49-49 .500 with Bucs (37-45 .451, and 0-2 post season (both home games) since Super Bowl)

On the Wade Phillips note:
Wade Phillips Playoff record at home
0-1
Jon Grudens Playoff record at home w the Bucs
1-2
Wade Phillips made the playoffs as a wild card team every year until last year. Wild card teams are expected to lose to the home division winner. Home, division winners, are supposed to win. So, to say Phillips can't hold Gruden's jock is ridiculous. Gruden has lost more home playoff games than he has won as a Bucs coach.
So Tom, what was your point? I guess your point is Philips can't hold Gruden's jock who can't hold Billick's jock who can't Switzer's jock.

[DR]

bobbyd,
OJ Simpson never got convicted of a crime. Osama Bin Laden never got convicted of any crime.
I agree, who cares about releasing Troupe. Gilmore was a good pick up. Bennett, who is that guy again? Didn't you all give Gruden praise for that trade?
It's funny watching you kiss up to your Gruden buddies.

[Tom]

DR, I'm glad you're in the political spirit of "spinning".

[Steve]

Thanks bobbyd,

I actually live in Charlotte NC currently but remain a Bucs fan. I can assure you I do not know any Panthers fans here that hate on their own team. Even last year when they Testeverde starting they all were optimistic, talking about how Matt Moore had beaten expectations and finding a few diamond in the rough instances to stay encouraged. Sometimes I wish I just had it in me to switch allegiances that way I could have people who actually pull for their team to have discussions with.

[BILL H]

DR SO YOU ARE TELLING ME HE WON 1 MORE PLAYOFF GAMES THEN PHILLIPS

[DR]

No, but like Tom said, i spun it, haha. I used that home playoff stat to stress the fact that if Philips had a team that was expected to win, than his post season record would have more meaning. Philips lost to strong AFC teams as Bills coach and didn't choke a game until last year. I put that game on Garrett before Philips. I'm not trying to say Philips is a great coach by any means, but he isn't nearly as bad as anyone says he is.
Gruden gets way too much credit for the good things here and everyone blames everything else for the mistakes he has made. I think even tried blaming the cheerleaders for a loss after bad play calling.
Gruden's offense keeps opposing teams in the game. His play calling may be the worst in the league. The NO loss is straight up Gruden's for not giving the ball to EG. But Gruden may have had an ego driven agenda that he put above the team. Don't put it past him that he was actually enjoying Garcia making mistakes so he has reason to bench him. He purposely game planned Keyashawn out of games in 2003.

[bobbyd]

I agree you DR, OJ Simpson never got convicted of a crime. I'm glad we agree on reality. Osama Bin Laden on the other has never faced a jury of his peers yet, but, while I'm not usually a betting man, I'd put quite a bit of money on his conviction if he is ever captured.

Bennett is an excellent insurance plan, because I'm sure you know (if you actually watch football) guys get hurt in this game. If you recall, in the Bucs distant past, we lost 2 starting running backs in the same season and actually had to pull in a guy who played solely in pre-season.

I don't really consider anyone here my friend, but I do like when people make interesting and intelligent comments. I despise moron-haters who know nothing about football and write things as stupid as "Another top notch free agent acquisition of the Allen braintrust! Sure glad we got him instead of Alge Crumpler." Doesn't take much to find out that Alge Crumpler has a whopping 3 catches so far this season, so I'm sure you can agree that's nearly as stupid as one could get.

[bobbyd]

"But Gruden may have had an ego driven agenda that he put above the team."

Now DR, that comment even dumber than the Alge Crumpler comment.

Here it is, as simply as I can put it. Every coach in the NFL has a job to do. They have to win games. And they MUST to win games otherwise they LOSE their job. Do you actually think for a millisecond that Gruden, or any other coach in the NFL, chooses players, or plays to stroke their own ego?

Good grief. If you really think that, you might actually be intelligent to qualify for a Martin Fennelly's job.

[nick]

FACTS
1)Jeff Garcia went to phily to be a backup. He took over, took them to division championship in toughest division, and won a playoff game: then PHILLY DID NOT WANT HIM! Its Gruden/Allen who saved GARCIA's career and got HIM a contract, not the other way around
2)2004 was not a rebuilding year, google search the articles, we were putting together another run at the superbowl, just so happened that the free agent pickups that year were not as good as the ones we brought it in 2002. 2005,2006 and 2007 were the rebuilding years, and yet Gruden won 2 division championships..DURING REBUILDING YEARS!!!
3)myth; gruden won superbowl with Dungy's team. truth- Dungy could not score a TD in three years with 'his' team, Gruden took it, added 40% new offensive team starters, and won the Superbowl against HIS OTHER TEAM, the Raiders. So gruden took 2 Teams to the SuperBowl!!!

People,Teams build,have runs, get old, rebuild. We are building the 5th Gen Bucs Team. Be patient.

[Pete]

Just for the record, I am a fan of our home team. I have traveled the world and over the years have taken a bunch of crap for being a buc fan. And to me that was OK, however you so called fans here in our home with all this negativity piss me off!!!!!!!!!!!!!

As a fan you support your team no matter what. Yes, coaches, management and players screw up as do every one of you! There are other teams you can follow!

[bobbyd]

Amen Pete.

I'll be the first to admit when I see something that truly doesn't make sense (like Gruden not calling enough run plays against New Orleans), but it's based on fact, not fantasy. All of the moron-haters know nothing about football and simply spew their drama like a bunch of chicks watching reality tv.

Make a valid point based on logic and stats we'll debate. Spew a bunch of "Fire Gruden, hire xxx", or "allen sucks at drafting players" or "so and so player is a bum" and you should be kicked repeatedly in the nuts until you bleed out of your nose.

[DR]

bobbyd, you Gruden supporters ignore the facts. Look at the offensive players drafted in Gruden's tenure.
#1, you all seem to forget that the Glazers put up two #1 picks to get Gruden so he could back stab his old team. Gruden, therefore, has earned more pressure which comes with criticism. it was expected of Gruden to compensate for the lost draft picks and he didn't. Clayton has been a bust, Caddy has been unworthy of a #5 pick overall, and Dexter Jackson will never be a top 3 WR on any team. It's a little early to judge, I know, but there are other players picked after that are having an impact on their team already. The offensive linemen have shown spurts of talent but struggle against the better teams which spells playoff loss if you get there. Gruden's savior has been an undrafted RB who he still refuses to give the ball to. Gruden has a terrible history of abandoning the run for no reason and it usually proves costly. If they don't fire Gruden, they desperately need to hire an Offensive Coordinator.

[Pete]

DR,

I don't know what world you live in but in mine Gruden compensated for the two 1st round picks given for him with a Superbowl win.................

By the way how about Tanard Jackson, Sabby Piscatelly and Adams etc ......

DR you don't know squat about football.............

[John Klopfer]

During free agency, how many people expressed an interest in Troupe????????
He is lucky the Bucs gave him a chance...not sure anyone else would. As for Crumpler...we have enough senior citizen to have our own chapter of AARP, why add one more? For those who complain about Stevens...he has kept his nose clean since he has been in Tampa...as Michael Pittman did before him. Sometimes thoses bad eggs can turn things around when given a different hen to watch over them.

[bobbyd]

DR, I am dumbfounded by your lack of understanding about football. How was Gruden going to "compensate" for lost draft picks?? Was he going to be on the field playing the role of two #1's and two #2's??? If your argument is that the Glazers overpaid for Gruden, you might have a case with me, but there's no coach in the NFL who can "compensate" for losing 4 top draft picks. The Bucs are just this season at a point where they're not hurting as much from those lost picks.

You sound like a politician. One minute you're defending Clayton, the next you're calling him a bust. Which is it, or are you talking out of both ends? Perhaps you're just talking out of one end. I think I know which end it is.

Exactly how was it Gruden's fault that Williams blew his knee? Before that, Cadillac was a very promising back (I can only dream what he would have been like behind this beast of an o-line). How was that a bad pick?

As for "firing Gruden", exactly why would they do that after the 2nd game of the season? Especially after the Bucs won their division last season.

Yup. I definitely know which end you're speaking out of.

The bucs will only win two more games this year and playing against the bears will not be one of them................

[Jesse]

Gruden Hater(s) & DR:

What matters more: all your great tidbits from the past, or winning now? There is a long season ahead, remember? It takes guts to make moves that we might question, especially unpopular ones. Winning is all that matters, of course, & cures just about everything in the NFL, maybe even hate, depending on the hater & its target.

I hoped Troupe would challenge all the TE's on the roster but am pleasantly surprised by Gilmore. I think Stevens has earned a spot on the team, or he would have been cut a while ago.

[jason]

wow -

[DR]

bobbyd,
What do you not understand. The Glazers paid way too much to get Gruden and they thought Gruden had a knack for talent which he has showed he doesn't. You're trying to give credit to Gruden for the defensive draft picks? haha, you're desperate for Gruden. Monte Kiffen is the only reason Gruden has a job. Monte's defense has kept this boat from sinking. Monte's defense won the Super Bowl.
Clayton had a great rookie year, and has been a bust since. I think he still has that 80 catch 1200 yard talent but he can't get those numbers while in Gruden's dog house. Caddy isn't even close to the worth a #5 pick is. He isn't even the 5th best RB in his draft class. He has been outplayed by a non drafted RB and it will be interesting to see who gets the ball when Caddy is healthy. Caddy wasn't a needed player that year anyway and they could have picked up a better RB in the later rounds, that is if they knew how to scout talent.
I'm not saying they should fire Gruden now, but if he doesn't get 8 wins, he should be fired ASAP. I can't believe they haven't forced him to hire an offensive coordinator. He's a horrible play caller.

[bobbyd]

DR,
You could be right on the "paid too much for Gruden" statement. But then again, he did what his predecessor couldn't, so one could argue that winning the superbowl was worth the price.

I can't say what the Glazers thought about Gruden (I can't read minds). I can assume they saw that he had a very successful offense in Oakland and hoped that would translate. It didn't, in large part because of the lineup of offensive players he inherited. What worsened the situation was that the price the Glazers paid was 2 season's worth of top-level reinforcements. Further, the Bucs were at a point where they had an aging defense and a less than talented offense and lacked the picks and salary cap room (thanks Rich McKay) to address it for several seasons. I'd contend that, given the circumstances of the 3 or 4 years after the superbowl, the Bucs as an organization have done a pretty decent job keeping the boat afloat. I believe this is the first season where that loss of picks should no longer be a major impact to the team.

You said: "I'm not saying they should fire Gruden now, but if he doesn't get 8 wins, he should be fired ASAP."

That is a practical and logical statement and I mostly believe the same thing. I might even go one further and suggest that if he doesn't win a playoff game, there should be serious consideration in his replacement. Of course logic has to be applied in that process. For instance, if the team is decimated by injuries again, it would be hard to argue that it was Gruden's fault. You have to look at all of the facts when making an assessment. There are some things that are just out of a coach's control and even the best coach in the world can't keep season-altering injuries from happening to their team.

As for Cadillac, I don't think he will ever be the same player again. That's not an injury that guys recover from. He'll be able to run, but he won't have the same speed, power or elusiveness he had before. But before the injury, Cadillac was magnitudes better than Graham. He ran with equivalent power (watch some highlights and watch him run through tackles), he had much greater speed (Graham couldn't outrun a linebacker in his 60 yard touchdown run this weekend) and he was far more elusive (as in dodging hits) than Graham. I'm not knocking Graham, I'm just saying from a logical and practical evaluation, that's what I see. That said, I think Graham is a fine running back and will do well for the team this season.

The big difference between you and I is that I don't bias my assessments on how much I like or dislike the personality of players and coaches (I personally feel Jon Gruden is a bit of a d!ck, but I don't care). I also understand the grass is not always greener and that having a superstar at one position does not always make up for having bad players at another. It literally takes all 53 players to take it all the way. That means sometimes you have to forgo the choice of a superstar and pick or sign a player that is just good.

[DR]

bobbyd,
I agree with most of what you are saying, but I won't give Gruden any leniency on missing four draft picks because that is what he knew he was stepping into and if not the Glazers, it was Gruden himself who was confident that the loss of four picks wouldn't cause a problem, or be as big of a problem. Gruden's offense has never lived up to expectation, not even in the Super Bowl year. His offense was ranked 18th in 2002. The defense played one of the best year's in NFL history. There is no debating that the defense won the Super Bowl. Dungy never had the personnel, but he did take his team to one big play from the super bowl with a terrible offense which was impressive in itself. He brought in the Johnson and Johnson connection and I have a hard time believing that Dungy wouldn't have picked up more offensive help if he was given another year.
As far as Caddy and EG, Caddy can't catch the ball out of the backfield and if it means losing a little bit of speed, than I'll take a RB who can catch the ball. That is the key to a west coast offense. Caddy is not a bad guy and it is a shame that his career may be close to being finished with the injury he has, but he wasn't the best available player in the draft when the Bucs took him.
Of course injuries are uncontrollable, but let's not pretend that the Bucs were the only team with injuries. Many teams had injuries, including playoff teams, and managed to make things work. Sometimes you have to change your ways to accommodate the talent you have and Gruden doesn't do that. Do you remember Grad's 40+ passes in windy conditions a couple of years ago? Gruden doesn't do the best job of getting the most out of his players. The NO game is his loss for poor management of the game and many other losses in the past.

[bobbyd]

Where did you ever hear or read Gruden say he was confident that losing 4 top picks was not a problem? Just because you think it, doesn't make it true. Show me a quote, because I have never heard that.

We could guess what Dungy "would have" done if he had another season, but it's simply speculation. Dungy had his chances to bring in the offensive personnel the Bucs needed, but one could easily argue the exact same thing you're arguing about Gruden. Dungy struggled to pick good offensive players and was never able to field an offense. In the end, the Glazers chose to part ways with him. I'm not convinced it was the right thing, but it is what it is.

You could argue that Marion Barber and Frank Gore are better than Cadillac and I'm not sure you're wrong, but the difference isn't night and day. Cadillac could easily have been a top back with this o-line. The thing about Barber and Gore is that 31 other teams passed on them too. Sometimes teams miss a gem. For example, everyone missed on Tony Romo (I'm sure you know he was undrafted). As for his pass-catching capability, the Bucs knew before they drafted him that he didn't do much of that in college, but he was developing nicely last season. I think he would have become as good of a receiving threat as Graham is.

I can't argue about playcalling other than to say every coach has bad games. There have been occasions when I was baffled by the playcalling. But you can't hold up one example of a bad game without pointing out the good games he's called. New Orleans game, I'd grade him a D. Atlanta, I'd say a B. But, if you were around in the Dungy days, surely you remember bad playcalling on a consistent basis. Run-run-pass-punt. Run-run-pass-punt.

[Steve L]

Nice thread. At least some *reasonably* intelligent debate.

Dungy’s old news. Dungy’s deification annoys me almost as much as the senseless Gruden bashing. Gruden (yes, Gruden) won a SB and we’ve alternated NFC South crowns since, so stop whining everyone. Believe me, it could be far, far worse and it used to be. This season is very, very young. The old axiom ‘it’s a marathon, not a sprint’ still hold true and is instructive.

Not sure what any of this has to do with the Bucs cutting Ben Troupe, but I digress.

[bobbyd]

Yeah, the thread really took on a life of its own. We started off on-topic and the next thing you know we're talking about Gruden, Dungy and Cadillac. At least we're still talking about football though. Another article's thread took a rather nasty political turn. I think someone eventually claimed that Obama was the reason the Bucs were gonna lose.

[DR]

Whether or not Gruden thought he was capable of overcoming the draft picks or not, he knew what he was getting into when he came here and nobody can make excuses for that. He came here to coach and knew it cost his team 4 draft picks, so in the process of his decision, he felt he can overcome it by taking the job.
Caddy is nowhere close to the talent of Marion Barber or Frank Gore. Those guys have it all. You can't expect a player who didn't catch the ball out of the back field to all of the sudden start becoming a legit threat as a receiver. It just doesn't happen that way. You can't blame the line either. EG's style of running is different, straight North and South. Caddy takes that stutter step that can cost 2 yards or more if the hole isn't there. In Eg's style, if the hole isn't there, its a 0 yard gain. I'll take a North South RB who can catch the ball out of the backfield and still break a 45 yard gain over flash anyday of
the week.
All teams miss players but I think the bucs have stretched for players when they didn't have to. Dexter Jackson, 2nd round pick and he is only returning balls. Passed on Brian Brohm and you can't be pleased with QB position they have right now. The Bucs could have resigned Thomas Jones and went with another pick over Caddy.

[DR]

bobbyd, where you at in the gridiron challenge?
Stephen, what kind of challenge are you putting up?

[bobbyd]

Gruden took the job because we was offered an assload of money. Plain and simple. I would venture a guess that losing those picks played no roll in his decision to come here.

The fact is, you take away the top 2 picks 2 seasons in a row from any NFL team and that team will hurt in the near future. I don't care if Vince Lombardi is coaching them. I'd challenge you to find any NFL coach who'd say they wouldn't mind giving up those picks in exchange for literally nothing. It's not like the traditional trade of picks for players. Those picks were traded for a coach, so they literally gave up 4 likely starters and got no additional players.

I'll continue to say it... it's always easy to say what a team SHOULD have done in the draft. What's not so easy is making the predictions BEFORE everyone knows how it turned out.

I think you're wrong about the talent comparisons between Caddy and Barber and Gore, but it's subjective so pointless to argue.

Dexter Jackson may not have been a great choice. I think they took a chance like Chicago did with Hester. As you admitted, it's still way too early, but judging by the Galloway news, we'll probably being seeing a bit more from D.J. sooner than later. I will definitely say I haven't been impressed yet.

As for the gridiron challenge, I'm sucking wind at the moment (ranked 307). This early in the season you're almost better off closing your eyes and throwing darts at the picks.