SI.com tabs Bucs among 'worst' offseasons

SI.com's Ross Tucker, picking which NFL teams have had the best and worst offseasons, leads off the worst with the Bucs, leading off with a blunt "Where do I start?"

Tucker is critical of the Bucs' change in leadership at head coach and general manager, and writes that Mark Dominik's decision to give tight end Kellen Winslow Jr. a new contract when he had two years left on his rookie deal sends an unclear message to "proven pewter stalwarts" like linebacker Barrett Ruud and tackle Donald Penn, who are waiting for new deals of their own.

The Broncos and Redskins are also chosen as having the worst offseasons, while the Patriots, Eagles and Falcons are Tucker's choices for making the most of the past five months. Do you think the Bucs deserve to be ranked among the league's worst offseasons?

-- We haven't heard much from veteran cornerback Ronde Barber this offseason, but a story at Buccaneers.com talks about his transition to a new defense, and how people who question if he can continue to play at a high level only serve to motivate him as he enters his 13th NFL season.

"Ronde's been one of those guys that's probably been doubted his whole career," coach Raheem Morris told the site. "He was a third-round pick and now he's the Buccaneers' all-time leader in interceptions. He's…the only cornerbacks to have 20/20 sacks and interceptions [in his career]. Any time you doubt a guy like that, you're calling him out. He's focused, he's locked in and he's right exactly where he needs to be."

-- Greg Auman, Times staff writer

Comments

[big007hed]

I think he is wrong in that the Bucs had the worst offseason but he made some valid points... The article doesn't say how Dunn and Brooks didn't do very much near the end of the season or how Gruden/Allen still hadn't won a playoff game since the Super Bowl Year, Dungy was fired for the same reason couldn't win the big games... Whatever Ross Tucker is a decent writer sometimes but the other times he is a complete idiot

[Leo In Canada]

While it is fun to speculate on EVERYTHING during the off season, just like the draft, only time will tell how good or bad any move was. One thing is for sure, change has been served.

[Dspkable]

Ross Tucker has never:
1. Worked in a NFL front office.
2. Coached along side NFL caliber coaches
3. Met Kellen Winslow or worked with him in OTA
4. implemented a new coaching team with new Offensive and defensive strategies
5. cared about the Bucs

So IF this guy thinks we had a bad offseason then its only because of all the changes and the uncertainty that comes with it. Yeah if I had the Patriots system I wouldn't change a thing either, but since we had lots of veterans near retirement and little indication those players were willing to step back and teach the new blood how to fill their own position, then this is what you have to do. I have always been disappointed that aging veterans don't recognize the importance of mentoring a player not just to be a good player, but to replace in the lineup for the sake of their franchise. But loyalty among franchises was eliminated with Free agency, and this is the way the business must be played.

[Jay]

Remind me again which trophy gets handed out for the offseason?

[ref813]

Ross gives us a fairly recently retired player's perspective. That shows in most everything he writes. His concerns with paying Winslow and Clayton while ignoring Ruud and Penn are perfectly valid. If I'm not mistaken, the majority of people on here didn't like the release of Brooks and others and think Ruud should get paid. Ross thought it was dumb to dump the leadership and to pay players for underperforming-Clayton-while ignoring those who have performed-Ruud. Nobody wants to be first on the "bad" list, but it really doesn't matter as you have pointed out. We are dealing with a lot of uncertainty. I'll judge the other moves later. They could still pay Ruud. The younger players could step up and lead, etc. A lot could happen that would make his points less valid, but, for now, they are as good of points as one could make about the moves. Many of us made them on this site. Now that an outsider has done it, people are mad.

[Erick]

Is this guy seriously putting the Bucs in the same category as the friggin' Broncos? Yes, some players should get paid, and there is that "uncertainty", but that is to be expected. THis team is by no means in disarray and is in much better shape than countless teams, especially the Broncos, and even the big spending Redskins. And exactly what did the Falcons do other than get a 30-something TE nearing the end of his career?

[Go Long]

Jay....the same one the Bucs are going to win this season - exactly. Nothing.

[Snook]

Trying to figure out how the off-season was so bad... The Bucs FINALLY have a REAL offensive coordinator. They have a new defensive coordinator who, with the exception of ONE season, has EXCELLED in the NFL. I could care less how old Morris is. He's got 2 coordinators with plenty of experience. We got rid of an injury prone old QB. We signed a 1000 yard rusher. We signed an elite TE. But whatever...

Afterall, what do you expect out of Sports Illustrated? That magazine is a rag. And when was the last time they predicted ANYTHING correctly?

[Snook]

I feel sorry for all the people drooling over the Atlanta Falcons. They still don't have a defense. And adding TG doesn't scare me. There's still only 1 football on the field at a time. The Falcons will regress this year. 8-8 is my prediction. Keep in mind, they're a franchise that's NEVER had back to back winning seasons in its 40+ year history. Pathetic.

[BucFandango]

I'm not going to judge them until the Season starts. No one expects to much so there is little chance of disappointing too many. It will become a reality check very quickly. Either the Glazers and their new Henchmen made the right moves and there is a glimmer of hope or they are on the road to disaster and all bets are off.

[Tony]

This SI article seems like a very superficial perspective. He didn't do his homework.

[ref813]

I only read the Bucs section of the article at first. His reasoning is a bit flawed. The moves that supposedly killed us-letting veterans go and paying Winslow before we needed to-were similar to things ATL did. They added A.G. and lost Milloy and another veteran D player. They also have a young D. I don't know how adding an aging TE is better than adding a younger and faster one who can play WR. Paying him was the problem given his few injuries. I think paying Clayton and Winslow while ignoring others and letting 2 of the best leaders on our team go were worse moves than ATL's, but not so bad that they deserve to be mentioned in the top 3 while we're 1st on the worst list.
Denver is worst. There's no denying that. At least our guys tried to land some big names rather than letting a potentially great QB walk. It sounds like Marshall wants to move somewhere where the police will leave him alone. You can't really blame the org. for that. The Cutler fiasco along with their failure to build up their D are two of the worst things they could've done. They don't even compare to the relatively minor errors our guys seem to have made. We'll know in a few months.

[OAR]

Let's be honest we gave Atlanta their playoff spot last year.

[BigBucDaddy]

You are the same people who will be grumbling about poor coaching and no talent when the Bucs get off to an 0 and 6 start. This guy is RIGHT ON with his criticism. This franchise is soon to re-take the Detroit Lions place as the worst in the game because we have THE WORST OWNERSHIP! Make no mistake, this is a bad team that didn't have to be. The Culverhouses have allowed it to become so by allowing their passion and wallets to shift to Man. U.

[1979 BucFan]

This guy http://BucStop.com wrote a good comeback for this jerk!

[OAR]

NikoH, yeah real good comeback there. He talks about the Lions scoring 17 points, but we won that game 38-20. So what's his point there? He talks about our "hell we've been through with Allen draft choices"? I think its funny the team is filled with them(ones the new regime hopes step up and become starters Black, Hayes, Hayword, Dexter, Clayton, etc) Our draft choices have been pretty good. Yeah there's the Dexter Jacksons, Claytons, and Dre Moores but there has been the Ruuds, Davins, Tanards, Phillips, Smiths(sorry I think his trade to Pats was stupid) and Talibs. He talks about Clayton and his contract and compares him to Penn and Ruud contracts. Ruud and Penn have been very productive Clayton not so much. Again what's his point?

[Kurt]

Is this really news to some of you? We've had a disasterous offseason in everyone's eyes outside of Tampa. We have done nothing significant or with any real charge to improve this football team (we already had good TE's and RB's.) Moreover, we have made and continue to make multiple questionable moves. It is what it is; Get over it!

[willem]

I only know SI from their bikini Models didnt know they covered the NFL as well?
Hmmm.....intresting

[knieto78]

There is so much that is written about the NFL and NFL teams but a lot of it is nonsense and easily and rightfully forgotten. There are some great writers out there - particularly Lombardi from the National Football Post and the fine people at Football Outsiders. These writers are great because they offer well researched material that is both entertaining and enlightening. They draw on experiences and factual/statistical analysis to support their conclusions.
But this guys criticisms are really unfair. First of all, he ignores the fact that the team had leveled out under Gruden/Allen (let's be honest it was really under Gruden, Allen was a numbers cruncher/patsy - it was always Gruden's team) and a change was desperately needed. We got a great young coach who, though not proven, has a giant upside.
Second of all the Ward signing was brilliant and will prove invaluable with a very solid and maturing line.
As for Clayton - that resigning was done at the insistence of the receivers coach based on how incredibly hard the guy plays, he's a beast and has shown flashes of brilliance at times... The KC game anyone?
As for Winslow, while there are still questions about his maturity and durability, he is a great weapon.Furthermore, and NO ONE has mentioned this to the best of my knowledge, Jags can run a two tight end set and have Winslow line up in the slot thus addressing some of the team's WR questions. He completely ignores the positives of the signing. The guy is a tremendous talent and may prove very beneficial... or may not but only time will tell.
As for Ruud, I'm sorry but I'm with management on this one. The guy has publicly stated that he wants a Lofa Tatupa type contract but has not really played to that level. He's had a couple of good seasons but still has serious flaws and was a big part of D that crumbled last year Remember our Bucs were tied or leading in the fourth quarter of each of those final four losses. The collapse was pretty epic. Let's see how he performs in a new system where much more will be expected of him before we make him a cornerstone or "pewter stalwart."
As for Penn, the guy has over-preformed and come a long way, he probably deserves a slightly better two or three year deal but I am not sure what he is asking for. That is a fair criticism.
As for the the draft- well that remains to be seen now doesn't it. I hope Freeman becomes the Roethlisberger/McNabb type we all see in him, but only time will tell. The rest of their picks were solid draft picks that may end up contributing immediately.
All in all it is a very, very unfair criticism and is just bad writing - poorly researched, not very well thought out and easily glosses over some blatantly contrary facts. The guy should work for Fox News with that type of writing.

Let's all hope for competitive football this season shall we, because realistically that's all we can hope for.

GO BUCS!!!!!

[knieto78]

I neglected to mention Rick Stroud and John Romano. They are great writers whom I thoroughly enjoy. They keep me in touch with the Bucs and for that I am very grateful.

[DR]

Don't get your panties in a bunch. Just an opinion that will be tested in a few months. Lot of teams were criticized last year and did well.
I think the Bucs are getting too much criticism for the coaching and GM change. The Bucs have been and needed fresh minds to take over. Are Morris and the Dom the right people? We'll find out in a few years.
Let's not forget that Gruden was voted amongst the players in the league as one of the least liked coaches to play for. People threw that away as a who cares poll, but look at the players that have been brought in threw free agency and you have to wonder. Bryant had a great year last year but this was his last chance. No other team wanted him. No other players have made a big impact on this team. How many pro bowlers did Gruden/Allen draft? Not many first choices.
The Glazers talked to the players and made the decision to fire Gruden. I can't ask owners to do much more in weighing their decision, especially after just resigning a coach to an extension the year before. The decision was the right one. Is Morris right? Time will tell.

[DR]

I agree that they are putting too much stock in the Tony Gonzales pick up. He was picked up to win now, and although I think Atlanta has a playoff team, I don't think they'll win. They'll be looking for a TE in a year or two while the Bucs won't be, hopefully. Winslow has potential, even more than Gonzales. He's more athletic and has already put up a great year and I think he can do it again in an offense that will utilize him the right way. I read that it was a mistake to get rid of Alex Smith, but where were his numbers? You all dog Clayton for disappearing but Smith did the same...and for the same reason. The offense under Gruden didn't fit the players.
The only weakness on the Bucs is the QB and that can be the difference in 4-5 wins. Winslow, Bryant, and Clayton have potential and Ward is the most athletic back the Bucs have had in a while. Yeah, you Caddy fans will hate me, but the Bucs should have never let Thomas Jones walk. Keep the polish looking good and make sure the rims are spotless, because the Caddy shouldn't be driven unless the weather is perfect. The Bucs will be fine without him. They just need a freaking QB to step up.

[Kurt]

FYI - Ross Tucker is an Ivy league grad, so to act you are more insightful (and I'm not saying he has a crystal ball,) but to act as though he is blowing hot air is fairly ignorant of yourselves. Gruden could have used some help as an OC, but other than that he was a very good coach and we were in just about every game with him at the helm. Ownership quit on everyone, including GruAllen after they purchased ManU, and anyone who doesn't wish to see that has blinders on. We will be decent to mediocre while GruAllend players are still on the roster and we will begin to slide into the Richard Williamson era shortly thereafter. This comes to me as horrible news as I am a season ticket holder and supporter from the beginning. However, the likes of ivy league grad Ross Tucker have a point in their synopsis. Atlanta has done everythig right uner their new management including signing the best TE to ever play the game. Did you guys forget that they signed the middle linebacker from the Jags too? Unfortunately, they are getting better while we are standing still at best. We drafted terribly this year. GruAllen drafted ok and there may be some stallwarts from their drafting/cultivating (Graham, Ruud, Jackson, Talib, the entire OL, and maybe even Clayton will one day regain his rookie form, etc.)

A lot of you don't appreciate the facts and basically ignore them, but we are not any better than we were after last season. I'd feel a whole lot better if we had Gruden training this QB (since he did put 3 underachievers at that position into the pro-bowl over his 7 year career,) than the crew of misfits we have now. I'm just sayin...

[Kurt]

...seven year Buccaneer career that is...I believe Gannon sniffed the pro-bowl once or twice while under his tutelege also...

[tbbucs4755]

In fairness there is probably plenty of criticism for the bucs off season though how it actually plays out is anyone guess. Can we really call any of these moves genious just yet?

- Handing the team to a rookie coach and GM
- Moving an injury prone and mediocre safety to replace the great Derrick Brooks (after all this is the same guy they thought could replace John Lynch who went on to play several more good seasons in Denver)
-Signing Michael Clayton and moving him into the starting lineup
-Bringing in Byron Leftwich to compete with Luke McCown for a starting job
-Extending the enigma Kellen Winslow's contract
-Failing to give Barrett Ruud a vote of confidence by signing him long term
-Doing little else in free agency (outside of maybe bringing in Derrick Ward - a situational runner who benefited immensely from letting Brandon Jacobs wear down defenses)
-Leaving few veterans outside of Ronde in the locker room to mentor some of this raw and unpolished talent

I really think the criticism is justified but hope I am wrong. I think the Bucs will be a 3 or 4 win team this year. That's life when you're rebuilding and I think it's clear the Bucs are rebuilding. The starting lineup on both sides of the ball has some big question marks and the depth is non existent...and there are always injuries in the NFL.

[DR]

Kurt, if anyone is wearing blinders, you are. Morris is stuck with one of the worst draft picks in Bucs history, Dexter Jackson and has nothing at QB. McCown hasn't proven anything in the NFL. Gruden picked up good QBs in free agency. He has no history in helping young QBs so he wouldn't help Freeman at all. Simms didn't pan out. Gradkowski was a failure. Gruden's best QBs were proven vets Gannon, Garcia, and his super bowl QB was Tony Dungy's pick up. Who thought John Lynch could be replaced? Oh yeah, that was Gruden as well, even when Lynch would have played for the minimum. He wasn't part of your guys' myth, he wasn't a salary cap casualty. They let him walk. It's funny that you say Gruden picked well. Morris is hoping Gruden's mediocre players can step up. If they do, it won't be because of Gruden. They were just mediocre under Gruden.

[Kurt]

I believe the medical staff and Kiffin were mainly responsible for the departure of John Lynch, but who cares about facts when you can't make a valid point right? Simms/Gradkowski were low draft picks, while Gannon/Johnson never sniffed a pro-bowl and Garcia hadn't had one in 5 years prior to hooking up with Gruden. I just hope our one win this season comes at the hands of the Cowgirls!

[Kurt]

...oh yeah, you must have picked the wrong day to stop sniffing glue eh DR? I'll be b!tchslapping you as always this year. The only hope we have is that mediocre Gruden talent laden offense with Gruden fostered McCown at the helm. We're toast if they can't do it. If they do, will you give Gruden any credit? No. You can't see the forest through the trees DR.

[Go Long]

Kurt is 100% correct. and DR is STILL AN IDIOT. Simms was McKay's draft pick - plain and simple. Gradkowski was a 6th rounder. Where are all of these brilliant young QBs that Gruden failed with that did something somewhere else??!! Simms has ALREADY been declared a back-up in Denver and they haven't even had training camp yet! Lynch - however you want to spin it - was a medical and the Bucs had the #! ranked pass defense in the NFL the year he went to Denver to play. SO THEY GOT BETTER. Quit living off of fan emotion - it doesn't win games - same way everyone crying over Brooks' release is doing. Anyone signed him yet? Yeah, there was a big long line huh after watching the last 4 games of last season. DR - do us all a favor and think before you write - anything - even a grocery list!

[knieto78]

You guys should check this out if you haven't already ... interesting commentary... Thoughts?

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Diner-morning-news-Glazers-have-a-plan.html

[Vincent]

Most of the comments are highly subjective. Kurt favors Gruden and his choices, where DR and myself do not. We can argue all the subjectivities to death. What is not arguable, is that Tampa had not won a playoff game since their Super bowl win under Gruden. In seven years Gruden failed to demonstrate ability to win in the playoff's and revisit the Super bowl, and there was already wide criticism that he won with Dungy's team. That is not subjective, that is fact! You or I may not like the decisions that were made, but the facts are the team had not won in 7 years under Gruden, ergo logic dictates that a decision to move in another direction with a new coaching staff, outweighs the probability of success under Gruden (given seven years of data). Remember, ownership can not fire themselves, so replacing the coaching staff is the only other option. Moving backward and suffering a worse season is considered more favorable than the perpetuity of the last seven years. You or I may not like that decision, but based on the evidence at hand, ownership made the choice they deemed most advantageous to long term success.

[BucFandango]

This guy http://BucStop.com wrote a good comeback for this jerk!
Posted by: Niko H | July 02, 2009 at 03:10 PM

If someone out there is willing to pay me $100, I'll to BucsStop.Net and read his "comeback" if it's legible. Any takers? I didn't think so.

Well gents, we got a little less than 6 weeks to the first Preseason Game. I think we'll have a pretty good idea about the team, even before Opening Day against the Brokeback Cowboys.

It sure would be nice if the Glazers would give us a break on Parking this year. That's a big fat OUCH! over the course of the season. Then again, this organization never was about rewarding the long time Faithful. Give it to the New Guy. Good Luck Barrett. Don't hold your breath.

[bucs?why?]

I would have expected nothing less than all these loser sucs fans defending their team and management...you are in for a rude awakening when the season starts and going 8 and 8 would be considered having done very well, considering the way the glazers have lost interest in the team and the new convoluted leadership. true championship teams, like the STEEELERS, have a track record both in drafting true talent and a long history of quality leadership..something your sucs have never had...so, sit back and get ready for a horrible season and I will be sure to check back numerous times this year to compare the STEELERS to your pathetic sucs...and come on, bring on your unfounded hateful, sophmoric comments, they do nothing but make me laugh.

[1979 BucFan]

Hey BUCFANDANGO...
here is your quote..
"If someone out there is willing to pay me $100, I'll to BucsStop.Net and read his "comeback" if it's legible."

you call THAT legible?

[BucFandango]

Niko, I completely agree with you on that one, but I am not a writer, don't run a website, and this site doesn't allow you to edit your comments or remove them once they have posted. Some sites allow this and it is a good feature. Some of us make mistakes here and there, me more than most. There is a spell check, but not an idiot check. Microsoft needs to have a warning pop up for that. "WARNING! everything you just typed makes you sound like a complete idiot!" Better yet "Warning! Are you Drunk? Please revise comment!" So, what about the $100?

[OAR]

Dallas Retard, how would we have paid Thomas Jones in beer and hot dogs. We did not have the money(in McKay cap hell), the Bears did. End of - "letting" T Jones go - story. He then ran off to Jets for more.

[OAR]

Snook, While I'm no fan of the Falcons. They have had back-to-back winning seasons 97-98,01-02 both under Reeves(you know the one that got them to the promise land, although they choked). You and Spin-DR need to check out things if your gonna spew.

[OAR]

Vincent, I gave Dallas Retard or Spin-DR a list of coaches(to answer his "name another coach that has gone 6 years without a playoff win" question; a Gruden hater question that he was sure there was there were not any), surprisingly some very successful & multiple SB wins(Fisher, Coughlin, Bilichick, Billick, Landry, Reeves to name a few), that had gone 6 years without a playoff win(some twice). So it's not the end of the world, not to win a playoff game in 6 years.

[Vincent]

OAR, let me just applaud that you took the time to look up those stats and back up your argument concerning the coaching tenures. So to show you respect, I looked up some stats of my own, because I love football, HA HA!

Billlick was hired in 1999 and won his first playoff game in 2001 against the Miami dolphins. He had a losing season in 2002, but was back in the playoff's in 2003 but lost to the Titans. They missed the playoff's in 2004 and 2005, and he fired the offensive coordinator (because he knew already, he was on the hot seat). When he took over as offensive coordinator, they turned in a team record of 13-3 and had their first bye week. But they lost in the divisional round to the Colts. In 2007 he was fired from the head coaching position. So Billick, unless I'm missing something, never went 6 years without a playoff win.

Jeff Fisher, you have a point. He hasn't won a playoff game since 2002 (6 years), however he's made three playoff appearances. However the statement you're sticking us to is the playoff win, so I'll give you that one, well done!

Coughlin was fired in 2002 after only three losing seasons with the Jags, with his last winning season in 1999, playing or the AFC championship. If you want to add his tenure as Giants head coach and call it a continuous record then yeah, I guess he did go 6 seasons without winning a play off game, but it was with two different teams. So if you don't count the fact that he got fired in the middle, then yeah I guess you're right, HA HA.

Bill Belichick is the same story as Coughlin. He had six losing seasons too, but it too was with two different teams, the Browns and the Patriots. He was fired from the Browns job after exactly 6 seasons without a playoff win and we all know of his illustrious history with the Patriots.

Dan Reeves, was in Denver for 12 seasons and made 3 Super Bowl appearances, so you do the math, he never went 6 seasons there without a playoff win. Then he went to the Giants, where he was fired after only 3 seasons (NEW YORK IS TOUGH). He was hired in 1997 by the Falcons, and was competing for the NFC Championship in 1998. In 2003 he was asked to step down (health risks), which gave him only FIVE seasons without a playoff win, HA HA!

Tom Landry was a head coach for 29 seasons, won 5 NFC championships, and two Super Bowls! He was an innovator on defense, and a legend of the game! Surely you can see why all=time greats like Landry are an unfair measuring stick for any coach, or captain of industry for that matter, to ever live up too?

All that being said, and I was just looking up the stats to offer you a worthy argument, do you believe that in this day, this football era, that many coaches are going to be afforded six seasons without a playoff win? As nerdy as I feel right now, that was fun!

[Vincent]

BUCS?WHY? Your comments are exactly why The Glazers moved to hire morris and company. Tomlin left and won the Super Bowl. Dungy left and won the Super Bowl. Lovee Smith left and participated in the Super Bowl. All these coaches were on the same roster at one point in time along with Morris as Buccaneer coaching staff. Morris was being interviewed for the Broncos head coaching vacancy, and the Glazers had to move fast, for fear of letting him go, and facing the shame of yet another great coach, leaving their ranks and competing for the Super Bowl. It was a cost benefit analysis, and hiring him to take over for the Bucs made sense. A losing season is not the end of the world, and honestly it's almost expected at this point. You are right about the Steelers dominance. In fact, Mike Tomlin and Morris are close friends to this day, and Tomlin is mentoring Morris' head coaching debut. In fact, the Bucs are essentially trying to copy-cat the Steelers in every way, starting with the drafting of QB Josh Freeman. In seven years, Gruden never put the QB of the future in place where Morris is carefully trying to establish one as soon as possible, for the QB is the lighting rod of success for most football teams. There will be struggles and bad seasons, but that's football! True Buc fans are not afraid of that, as I'm sure true Steeler fans, or any other true fan of any team is unafraid. As to your accusations of a cheap owner, the Glazers were already willing to shell out the money for Haynesworth, Favre, Allen, and until recent times, were usually about $19 million over the cap, so I don't see them as being cheap. Yet the Glazers don't dictate who signs where, they can only put a deal on the table. Haynesworth has already gone on record, claiming that the Bucs offered more money (20% more), but he selected Washington for the long term marketing benefits in "branding" himself, after his career is over. The only thing I don't understand is your apparent animosity, and rancor towards the Buccaneer organization? They aren't a rivalry to the Steelers? In fact they´re almost "sister teams" at this point, because of Tomlin and Morris' close connection. The Bucs don't have a long history of Super Bowl wins that usually accompanies resentment from other teams, and Tampa is not even in the same conference with the Steelers! So I'll leave that to you, because it's not my concern.

[OAR]

Vincent, you probably feel nerdy, cause you looked up way more detail then I did. First my point(not taken) was that Gruden was not the only coach to go 6 seasons without a playoff win. Second, to answer your "do you believe that in this day, this football era, that many coaches are going to be afforded six seasons without a playoff win?" question, your answer lies there within. This football era. I guess I'm just old school and appreciate when teams could give players and coaches a chance. In this era, Cohwer was given a long one for a ring and Fisher he's still on his chance. Holgrem is another one, that had Seattle given up on him they would never have went.
As for Coughlin and Billick there seasons were split between two teams, yes. I thought I'd throw it out there, sense there's always talk "of oh, it was so and so's team(I guess it doesn't work the other way?)
As for the Steeler's Tomlin, good thing he didn't need a qb, huh?
As for Dungy, it took him another 4 years with new team(one with a prolific offense to boot).
As for Lovie, lucky is a good word.
Don't forget to put Herm or Lewis on your list, oh yea never mind they both suck as a head coaches. BTW; why does Lewis(shoot even Crennel) still have jobs.

[BucFandango]

Isn't there only one Victory that really counts in the NFL? Aren't all the rest just "Also Rans"? Second place or First place loser? Great, you made it to the Superbowl, but didn't win. Won't they forget that in a year or two? There is only One real prize. Aren't there still 9 or 10 teams that still haven't won a Superbowl? For me, that's all that counts. Nobody wants to lose more games than they win, but 1 playoff win or 2, if you don't make it all the way, your just another team. Chucky didn't do this or Chucky didn't do that. Blah blah blah. He won the one game that really counted. He and the team could have lost that game and how would all the fans feel? The point is that Buc fans should feel lucky, should be thankful, and should move on and stop bashing a man that put his heart and soul into his work. Whether he met their standards or not, I don't understand all the Hate for Chucky. I mean, if you're going to hate someone, hate the Ayatollah, Osama, Ahmadiniweenie or Kim Jong Il. Hating on a coach like Gruden just makes you look insecure and weak...or maybe you just can't get a woman...or have an ugly one and can't make her happy. I don't know, but get over it already.

[1979 BucFan]

BUCFANDANGO- LOL - very good, a posting breathalizer plug in!

Ok Peace brother. were all in this together. it may be a long season!

We'll be drinking one way or another....

now, what do I get for $100? how many page hits??

[Drew]

With each win I shall savor it as a shot of Jack Daniels sliding smoothly down my throat as if it's silk.

With each loss I shall lose my ability to read the Jack Daniels written on the label of the bottle and shall awaken with a tremendous hangover. Along with the hope the bucs don't lose again.

[Kurt]

Nice one Fandango! Let's rejoice in the words of football's greatest hero, Vince Lombardi who once said, "I'd rather have a lucky team than a good one!" Cheers! Here's to hopes of a lucky team this year...

[OAR]

Outside the box: Has anyone else been to the Buccaneers website? It looks horrible now. They changed everything. The photos at top of page have some sort of touch-up/darking photoshop done to them, puke!

[OAR]

Outside the box: Has anyone else been to the Buccaneers website? It looks horrible now. They changed everything. The photos at top of page have some sort of touch-up/darking photoshop done to them, puke!