Times tough for social conservatives

Barbara Wilcox of Tampa is a committed Christian and socially conservative Republican whose fiercely held views are sharpened by decades of political activism.

But the retired Realtor is already on her third presidential candidate - from Fred Thompson to Mike Huckabee to Mitt Romney - and is running out of choices, which she's not happy about.

"He's very liberal," Wilcox says dismissively of GOP front-runner John McCain. "He's good for war, but I don't think he's good for the people of the United States. He doesn't listen."

For Wilcox and other social and religious conservatives in Florida, these are tough times. After a decade of playing a prominent role in state politics that helped engineer a Republican takeover and Jeb Bush's two terms as governor, such voters now appear out of step with their party's leaders. (story here)

Comments

Thats because they are morons. The social conservatives and Jebites are so out of step with the mainstream. They have ruined the Republican party. And they have the nerve to call Republicans that are the TRUE GOPer's RINO's. They all need to pull their collective heads out of the sand and open their eyes to the REAL WORLD. Moderate is where both parties need to be, so the we can have some solutions to the problems our nation is facing. People are Mad as Hell!

[Bill]

Boo, hoo, hoo

Go back to doing the work of the church, not trying to inflict you values and lack or morals onto the rest of us.

[Michael Harris]

With all due respect, Barbara Wilcox represents a conundrum in the Christian world. Which is: politics has virtually nothing to do with the Gospel of Jesus Christ, (the one who Wilcox and her peers profess to believe.) Jesus proved that he didn't want to even discuss the issue of politics when someone tried to get him involved in the politics of the day. He asked to be brought a coin. Holding it up he said: "render unto Caesar the things of Caesar and unto God, the things of God." In other words: the two DON'T mix. Ms. Wilcox would do well to learn that lesson; and focus more on the Gospel of Jesus, which is: spreading and practicing unconditional love to mankind and the animal kingdom. IF she's truly read her Bible, then she already knows the end of the story, which is: WE WIN!!! K? The Constitution of the United States, specifically states that there shall be a separation of church and state. Notice how her fearless leader, George W. Bush, spent his campaign dollars prior to the 2000 & 2004 Presidential Elections, professing his Christianity; and since entering the White House, we've heard nothing of his Christianity and seen none of the fruits, which should be manifested by a true Christian. I hope that Ms. Wilcox will learn not to be the tool of villains anymore; and how not to be used by the hypocrites, such as George W. Bush, who started a war, for which Pope John Paul II nor Jesus approved.

I am a very conservative Christian and I am voting for John McCain. I like him and think he is right for our country now. So, I reject the premise that conservatives are in tough times. Even Mike Huckabee has pointed out what people like Wilcox will not face. Romney has never been conservative and many of us think he is only saying he is in order to get our vote.

typical media template story - why not mention the quandry that black democrats are in, or the quandry that women democrats are in - nope, always gotta have stories to create so mythical permanent rift in republicans

at least republicans are fighting over ideas - democrats are fighting over gender and race

[steprazor420]

socially conservative is not fiscally conservative. Social conservatives have no problem growing government to achieve their agenda, nor tdo they have a problem with govermment playing a predominant role in our lives. They are the antithesis of Goldwater conservatives, and the people are tired of them...Super Tuesday's race is the Gallagher/Crist race on the naitonal stage. One can only hope the results are similar.

I thought one of the main principles of being a Republican is "limited government." To me that means smaller & less gov't. And since there is a separation of church & state that to me means less or no gov't to morally dictate what I choose to do with my body (abortion). There is a difference between pro-abortion & pro-choice. Pro-choice doesn’t mean pro-abortion. I have my faith, which gave me strength when I was young to choose to give birth to a wonderful son when several of my friends or girls at my age were choosing to have abortions. I never interfered in their decision & neither should gov't or politicians because it is a personal choice.

We as a nation have larger issues to deal with & it is not religion. Religion is what or nations are imposing on individuals...and look how they live or how they use religion to terrorize. This separation of church & state is what makes us so great.

Perhaps the social conservatives should help advise and work on is ways to strengthen families (the center machine driving the economy) & how to encourage adoptions & abstinence. Then there is the same-sex marriage issue…that does not take a rocket scientist to figure that out nor should religion be the sole basis of determination. Typically same-sex couples do not produce offspring, which hence does not create a strong family, which then does not help the economy.

Anyhow…I am a Republican who believes in less gov’t, lower taxes, leaving me with more money in my pocket. I believe Democrats want to turn this country into big government spending by brainwashing people to believe that there is no need to work hard b/c “big brother” will take care of you. If I was able to overcome challenges without gov’t assistance so can others if they put their minds to it.

[Chris W]

Here you see the problem faced by the GOP this year. (As a Democrat, it's fun to watch someone else go through this.)

On the one hand you have your "up from the bootstraps" folks like 9:11 am there. On the other hand you have your Christian "conservatives" who are militantly convinced that the state ought to get involved in making people "good" for the good of society and, since they take their concept of "good" from their religion, think this gives them leave to try and force it on us for our own benefit whether or not we want it.

They're at odds with the bootstrap fellows who don't think they need any conservative Christian help, thank you very much, so would the Christians please vote for tax cuts and then go away.

I am a social conservative AND a fiscal conservative. That is why Romney is my only choice. I have no problem with McCain's stance on social issues, it is his votes against the Bush tax cuts, not just the vote, but also the Democrat talking points and "class warfare" he used to defend his vote.

[Dee]

It is amazing how so many political discussions lead to the abortion debate.

The pro-choice crowd now puts forth the same approach as the pro-slave crowd did in days gone by.

If life does not begin at conception then when does it begin? If you have an abortion you are destroying an unborn child and that is the bottom line. The pro-choice crowd is pro-abortion and thus support killing for convenience.

If social conservatives have a problem it is with the government overreaching in its secular zeal. This includes the taxing of income for the purpose of redistributing wealth to those of the governments chosing. Jesus did not take from anyone to provide for another. He did not stand in place and hand out fish every day, instead he made fishers of men.

8:54 is full of crap, hillary is mor econservative than mcamnesty..study politics, learn the differences of the left and right sides of the spectrum and you would realize that voting for mccain is the worst thing a TRUE republican can do.

Her is what the so called religious conservative says about Mccain..."he is good for war"...Do some of these people truly have a concept of what God is?. Tell all the innocent victims of wars of humanity what "good for war" value means. Oh, I forgot they are poor non-white and not like you so who cares.

I am a born again Christian. I am a conservative Republican. I am supporting John McCain. Romney was pro-choice (more pro-choice than Ted Kennedy)up until a few years ago. I'm sorry, but you do not change your views on those types of issues later in life. Maybe when you are in your 20's or early 30's but not at Romneys age. He will say anything to win. At least McCain is the same as he has always been.

Michael Harris please tell me where in the constitution that the separation of Church and State is. If you would clearly read our found document you would know that it is not there. Before you criticize others you may want to check your facts. Here is a link to the constitution please tell me where the separation of Church and State is...what article and section. http://www.law.emory.edu/index.php?id=3080

Wait, I think it is funny how you say that you are a "born again Christian" and then later in the paragraph you make comment about how someone can't change their "views on issues later in life." Are you in your "20's or early 30's?" I think that becoming a born again Christian is a pretty big life changing decision. And why can't someone change their decision on that. Maybe they saw the light.

I'm not born again, I got it right the first time.

Michael Harris the idea of seperation of church and state is not found in the Constitution at all. You have to go find a letter Jefferson wrote to the Danbury Baptist Association in 1802.

You may want to study American History before you profess to know it.

and I couldnt be happier!!

these bozos have hijacked the gospel, turning it into an instrument of devisiveness instead of inclusiveness.

somehow, they believe their own fears, insecurities and even hatred of things different from them and their narrow world-view are reflected in jesus' life death and resurection and joyfully brand anyone who disagrees with them, in the slightest, as evil, secular humanists or some other blather.

the world will be well rid of them as we would any sort of dumbdamentalist, from christian, thru hindu to muslim.

fundamentalism is a profound theological error if not a heresy.

regarding separation of church and state:

seems to me you folks need to consider the history available to the "founders".

in 1776, the memories of the english civil war (1640--1660) were still pretty fresh in their collective memories. Remember that little affair?

where charles I, i believe, was beheaded and his head put on a pike?
by sincere "religious reformers"?

also, many of the colonies had religious tests.

in light of just those TWO issues, i think it is clear to all but the most obtuse that the "founders" did NOT want a state church, pew taxes, religious tests or anything that remotely smelled of the government favoring one particular faith expression over another.

whatever yo want to call it, or however you want to phrase it, the first ammendment and the history surrouding it makes it prettydamn clear the "founders" did NOT envision favoring one particular faith over another.

end of discussion!!

10:08 Are you just dumb or what?

The text of the amendment is:

“ Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

ATTNENTION dumbdamentalists:

the phrase "born again" can also be translated "born from above".

now doesnt that make for a fairly different discussion?

of course, if you BELIEVE that jay-sus wrote the entire bible himself, personally, including the red letters, whatever an intelligent person may say has absolutely no relevance in your world, does it?

just as with "virgin".

scholars still cant agree whether the hebrew means VIRGIN or simply a YOUNG WOMAN!!

thinking is SO CONFUSING, isnt it?

Attention GOP Leadership: If McCain becomes the nominee and you are wondering why in a tight race, a substantial portion of your party's base is either apathetic or supporting the opponent, take a look at the comments above. This is classic McCain. Mock the Christians. Curse out the social Conservatives. Scold the fiscal Conservatives. Hurl accuasations of racism at those who disagree. These posts are actually quite reflective of John McCain, which is why he will never get my vote.

11:20, And that's just when he's trying to "unite the Party!"

[Bella]

Separation of church and state.....
is often identified with the First Amendment to the United States Constitution, which states that "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof…"

The phrase "building a wall of separation between church and state" was written by Thomas Jefferson in a January 1, 1802 letter to the Danbury Baptist Association where he referenced it to the 1st Amendment.

The treatment of religion by the government is broken into two clauses: the establishment clause and the free exercise clause.

The United States Supreme Court has referenced the separation of church and state metaphor more than 25 times.

I find it almost incomprehensible how anyone who considers themself a social conservative would rather support those with socialist ideals rather than someone from their own party.
I am a fiscal conservative and social moderate. I am really tired of the radicals on both sides trying to inflict their beliefs and values on me.

Thank goodness for Huckabee pointing out Romney's failings as a true conservative. Why does Barbara Wilcox think we should believe this "Rush" blather about Romney's 'conversion' to conservatism?
Prediction:

ROMNEY WILL BE ROASTED ON THE FIRES OF HYPOCRISY TODAY!!

9:41 Chris W. I share your pleasure at seeing the GOP mired in conflict, but I disagree with your insinuation that the DEMs have recently been experiencing the same situation.

Many DEMs have one specific area of concern that tends to dominate their time and effort, but it is usually not in direct opposition to other DEMs concerns. The GOP, on the other hand, all agree on their main agenda, which is the continued enrichment of the very wealthy, but in their efforts to acheive this goal, the numerous rationalizations they adopt often prove to be in direct opposition to one another, as you have pointed out in this particular case.

The main reason why we have a GOP dominated government is because they have proven successful in compromising their so-called beliefs in the name of political expediency, whereas the DEMs tend to be so focused on their own areas of concern that they frequently are not motivated to get involved in other DEMs different but equally valid efforts.

I don't believe that "middle of the road" is where DEMs belong right now, 7:31, because the GOP is not going to dissolve into confused fragments any time soon. Come election day, they will forget their differences, which are after all only skin deep, and band together like always to support whatever candidates they believe will best accomplish the transfer of the wealth of our country into their superior and much more deserving hands.

DEMs need only to look around and take stock of all the many areas in which our freedom is under attack, and get out and support one another in our efforts. Fortunately because the GOP is united in their main agenda, it does make the effort of opposing them mcuh simpler. All the DEMs need to do is show up at the polls, and vote against everyone with an "R" next to their name. As far as other ballot questions, you can safely ignore any GOP sponsored bills, because, regardless of the whitewash which may have been spread over them by the well funded GOP spin machine, at the core they all have the same net purpose - enriching the wealthy - and they can be safely voted down.

So DEMs, the solution is simple: get out and vote DEM, and always vote NO to any GOP sponsored legislation.

why are mcamnesty and his supporters asking us to back him "for the good of the Party" now...when he was AWOL on matters of deep concern "for the good of the Party" for more than the last decade?

The GOP of this past decade are what has ruined the Party... get a clue 1:22, McCain is the only hope of actually saving the GOP from complete ruin. You need independent and crossover voters to win elections.

I hope that the GOP is finally DONE, GOOD RIDENCE.

The GOP is far from done. But I do believe that the new party will be more moderate. At least that is my sincere hope. I am tired of the Limbaugh and Coulter mind-set.

[Chris]

I am a fiscal conservative and social moderate - I WOULD have supported Romney 100% had he heeded Polonius' advice. I am impressed by his record in Massachusetts and in the private sector.

HOWEVER, that he had to abandon those successes in favor of trying to get himself elected by saying and doing anything is why I had to abandon him.

"This above all - to thine own self be true"

[Sound Off]

I was a Republican all of my life, until 1992, when after the first incompetent Bush, 41, chose to run for the office again, after ruining the economy of the country; or atleast adding to the damage that he and his predecessor had done. That election I voted for Ross Perot. Then in 1996, the Republicans chose to run another incompetent, Bob Dole, (too bad they didn't choose Elizabeth), and I wrote my name in for President, realzing that I was more competent than Bod Dole. Then came the 2000 Election. I told a close friend, "I'm from Texas, I know all I need to know about the Bush Family, if George W. Bush gets the nomination, I'm leaving the Republican Party forever." Which I did. The Republican Party needs to change its name to: "The Party of Religious Hypocrites" or better yet: "The Party of Pseudo Christians, alias Neo Cons", who claim to be Christians with lip service but deny him by supporting favors for the rich and invading foreign countries for profit. Lyndon Johnson was a closet Republican, who was in bed with the
Military Industrial Complex, the way George H.W. Bush and Jr. are with it today. The Conservative, Fundamentalists, Christians are being used by the Neo Cons, to do their bidding and catapult them into office, so they can get rich off the blood of our children in bogus wars. The Bill of Rights clearly implies that there shall be a separation of Church and State; and most of Thomas Jefferson's writings about the subject, leave no room for doubt on where the founding Father's stood on the subject of integrating the two.

Huckabee is a slimey opportunist posing as a "Christian" who accepted thousands of dollars in clothes, over 50K in one year for himself and his wife Janet when he was governor.

Huckabee was reported no less than 5 times to the Ethics Commission in his home state of Arkansas accroding to the Arkansas Business Journal.

Today he and Mccain cut a back room deal ad McCain talked his supporters into switching their votes to Huckabee in the West Virgina race. Huckabee placed second to Romney in the first round by a substantial margin.

For some reason they run this ballot again and have the top 3 compete.

Suspciously, McCain only got 12 votes in the second round, so Huckabee beat Romney.

Welcome to a Democratic 4 years if Romney bows out. Hopefully he won't. McCain will never ever be supported by the base of the party for his liberal record and this disgusting political play.

Way to go wasting your "conservative leadership" supporting Mike Huckabee Marco; you political capital is spent.

Here is the bottom line:

Conservatives do not need the GOP. The GOP needs Conservatives.

The GOP obviously believes that they can win without Conservatives and is banking on Democrats voting for Republicans who will govern like Democrats instead of voting for Democrats who will govern like Democrats.

It will be McCain vs Clinton

& John McCain will be the 44th President of the United States of America.

You heard it here first.

If Hillary wins, a large percentage of Obama supporters will never vote for her no matter what.

They would rather vote for maverick John McCain or stay home.

read this blog:

http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/01/if-not-obama-th.html

5:20pm,

Do you even know hat you are talking about? W. Virginia is a caucus state. Do you even know how a caucus work.

You can have 2nd & 3rd & 4th votes

[Live With Your Means]

5:20pm,

Do you even know what you are talking about? W. Virginia is a caucus state. Do you even know how a caucus work.

You can have 2nd & 3rd & 4th votes

9:16, I have never voted for a Democrat in my life and I won't start now. Now way in hell I'll vote for McCain!

To 9:16 p.m.: You're probably right. I have this to offer, (a famous quote from Sir Winston Churchill): "The best argument against democracy, is a five minute conversation with the average voter." Certainly, Sir Winston was speaking of those who vote for John McCain, who is a Pimp for the Military Industrial Complex and Corporate America. "If you want 100 years of more war in the Middle East, vote for John McCain." Chris Matthews, MSNBC. The new cottage industry for America is War. The U.S. is no longer a player in: the auto industry, technology, agriculture or service. The only thing the U.S. knows how to do better than any country??? WEAPONS OF WAR AND the execution of WAR. Do you like the past seven years? I imagine you have to either get drunk or take massive doses of Tylenol PM to sleep right? Oh and like Vampires, certainly you've done away with the mirrors in your house right? As the song says: "War...War....War....what is it good for....everybody", sing it now: "War....War....what is it good for"??? And the answer: it's good for the MIC and Corporate America vendors and employees who provide products and services for WAR. What a bunch of freakin idiots the Repubs have become. They're being used by their own party and don't know it; and even if they did know it, wouldn't care. Idiots!!!

To: 10:35pm,

I want a President that has integrity, honor, strength, and experience. Most of all, I want a President that will keep our nation safe from foreign invaders and terrorists. I do not ever want to see another 9/11 in our homeland. The person that most represent these quality is war hero JOHN MCCAIN.

Hillary & Obama would be very scary for our country's national security.

10:35 P.m. In other words, you've bought into all the baloney spewing out of this administration and you've bought in to the 911 bull hockey. It's people like you who scare me; not the terrorists. The real terrorists of this country are currently running it; and I might add: running it into the ground. People like you make me sad for America; and yet I fear there are more people like you than people like me, who possess intelligence and common sense and the ability not only to smell a fart in the church pew but to know who farted.

“Always there has been some terrible evil at home or some monstrous foreign power that was going to gobble us up if we did not blindly rally behind it. I am concerned for the security of our great Nation; not so much because of any threat from without, but because of the insidious, (political), forces working from within." WWII Five Star General: Douglas MacArthur

THE BIGGEST LIE THAT McCAIN AND THE REPUBLICANS ARE TELLING, IS HOW THE DEMOCRATS ARE GOING TO RAISE YOUR TAXES. SO FAR THE IRAQ WAR HAS COST OVER $492 BILLION. THE REPUBLICANS HAVE BEEN BACK DOOR TAXING YOU, YOUR CHILDREN AND THEIR CHILDREN, WITH THE UNJUST AND BOGUS IRAQ WAR....................................

"A true patriot must always be ready to defend his country against his government."
~Edward Abbey

We must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the military-industrial complex.
~Dwight D. Eisenhower, 34th President of the United States

"Our country is now geared to an arms economy bred in an artificially induced psychosis of war hysteria and an incessant propaganda of fear." ~WWWII Five Star General Douglas MacArthur

“Violence as a way of gaining power...is being camouflaged under the guise of tradition, national honor [and] national security... War is not the continuation of politics with different means, it is the greatest mass-crime perpetrated on the community of man.”
~Alfred Adler

[Sound Off]

The above brought to you by a True Patriot. Sound Off

[Sound Off]

If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy.
~James Madison

People do not make wars; governments do.
~Ronald Reagan

Paramount among the responsibilities of a free press is the duty to prevent any part of the government from deceiving the people...
~Hugo Black, Supreme Court Justice

The dangerous patriot...drifts into chauvinism and exhibits blind enthusiasm for military actions.
~Colonel James A. Donovan, Marine Corps

It is a truism that almost any sect, cult, or religion will legislate its creed into law if it acquires the political power to do so...
~Robert A. Heinlein

Military justice is to justice what military music is to music.
~Groucho Marx

The opinion of 10,000 men is of no value if none of them know anything about the subject.
~Marcus Aurelius

It is the job of thinking people not to be on the side of the executioners.
~Albert Camus

Every nation has its war party. It is not the party of democracy. It is the party of autocracy. It seeks to dominate absolutely.
~Senator Robert M. La Follette

From the 1976 Movie ‘Network’

Howard Beale: 'I'M AS MAD AS HELL, AND I'M NOT GOING TO TAKE THIS ANYMORE!' I want you to get up right now, sit up, go to your windows, open them and stick your head out and yell - 'I'm as mad as hell and I'm not going to take this anymore!' Things have got to change. But first, you've gotta get mad!... You've got to say, 'I'm as mad as hell, and I'm not going to take this anymore!' Then we'll figure out what to do about the depression and the inflation and the oil crisis. But first get up out of your chairs, open the window, stick your head out, and yell, and say it:
Howard Beale: [screaming at the top of his lungs] "I'M AS MAD AS HELL, AND I'M NOT GOING TO TAKE THIS ANYMORE!"

[Joe]

How many of these "Social conservatives" have adopted a thrown away child? Religion shud have no part in politics. Bush has used it well over his term, and the term has given religion a very bad name if that is all it takes to run the US government. I don't want a holier-than-thou president. I want one who has brains & who understands lives of normal people.
I don't want to pay for illegal aliens, I don't want to be in wars, I just want to raise my crops. Vote? No one has really impressed me yet.

[Clyde]

For those of you who are hyperventilating, breathing into a paper bag usually works. For those of you who claim to be "born again" Christians, I urge you to read all the red print in the New Testament, compare those words to your behavior, and then start acting like true Christians.

It is wonderful to see folks like Barbara Wilcox finally in a desert.