Targeting Tampa's gay marriage opponents

Thousands of Tampa-area voters who signed petitions that helped the so-called Marriage Protection Amendment get on the Nov. 4 ballot are receiving this letter from the opposition, suggesting they might have been "misinformed" about what they were signing.

The letter from the Red and Blue Committee says, among other things: "People collecting petitions aren't always honest about the issues they're pushing -- especially if they're paid by the signature." That  infuriated Florida Family Action, the group seeking to put a same-sex marriage ban in the Constitution, because its petition-gatherers were unpaid volunteers. (Red and Blue countered that its letter did not specifically accuse Florida Family Action of paying for signatures).

The letter looks like a warm-up for a petition revocation effort, except that wouldn't make sense. The same-sex marriage ban is already on the ballot, as Amendment 2. Asked why the letter focuses on Hillsborough County (and Leon), Red and Blue spokesman Stephen Gaskill said: "Obviously, statewide elections are won in the I-4 corridor, so we're starting in Tampa, where we have a strong base of support." Florida Family Action says "homosexual activists" are behind the letter.   

Comments

REMEMBER THIS PLEASE:

everytime psychologists have interviewed and subsequently tested "opponents" of homosexuality, the folks with the strongest opinions AGAINST have over and over again, demonstrated the MOST ARROUSAL to homosexual images as opposed to those with less strong opinions against.

wonder what that reallreally says about all these folks so wound up about another's sexuality?

that they wish they were, too?

maybeeeeeeeeeee??

ask one of 'em the next time they hand you a petiton to sign:

"what's with your oposition?

do you secretly wish you were?"

you can also ask them:

"how come you are always picking on males?

is it because you DO like the idea of lesbians getting it on?"

finally, on behalf of ALL INTELLIGENT and MATURE CHRISTIANS, i'd like to apologize for the actions of our sisters and brothers who somehow have reached the conclusion that what two consenting adults do in the privacy of their relationship, is more important than feeding the hungry, ministering to the sick and clothing the naked, even tho Jesus seems to have made those missions imperative.

how great it is - the lefties who are so opposed to voters' right to remove their names from petitions are using the very same argument that proponents of removal use:

"People collecting petitions aren't always honest about the issues they're pushing -- especially if they're paid by the signature."

I think that the effort to ban gay marriage is just as wrongheaded as previous efforts in history to ban interracial marriage. "The whole civilized world will fail down around us if we let this happen," they say, but the reality is very much the opposite.

I just don't see why I should much care what other people do. I am a white, male, heterosexual, married person (to a woman) with two children. Civilization will not end if gay men and women are allowed to marry. My religious rights aren't impacted. My soul isn't at risk. Why should I (or 60%+ of my neighbors) want this in our constitution?What "right" am I protecting? I just don't get it.

Two wrongs don’t make a right, and two gays can’t make a baby!

This will pass with 68%. It has nothing to do with being homophobic, and everything to do with natural order. You may not agree with it, but it is what it is.

"natural order"...like in the bible?

where we will find slavery, arranged marriage to children, polygamy, idol worship, and on and on....all practiced by GAWWWD's people.

check it out!!

i think 12:25 is RIGHT, you're simply afraid to admit to your REAL sexual preference!!

you can COME OUT, you know!!

besides, who is it that says, that committed or married partners HAVE TO REPRODUCE?

best you tell that to GAWWWD and the Holy Family, huh?

No, 3:30... aka: freak... Natural order as in;

Two wrongs don’t make a right, and two gays can’t make a baby!

3:30,

That’s just like you Bacon, Lettuce, and Tomato’rs… every one who disagrees with your lifestyle choice must be a closet mudhole’r or two-can-chew.

This… my little square peg in a round hole’r… is why you can’t get anywhere with your agenda.

[Omega83]

2:48 plenty of heterosexual couples are unable to biologically reproduce.

Shall we make reproductive ability the sole criteria for marriage?

as_shole

Omega... read s l o w l y... Natural Order.

But I can guarantee you they will never reproduce having intercourse in the as_hole… as_hole!

The gay community was making great strides until they invited transexuals, transgenders, and every other freak into their big diverse tent...

BANG-O-RANG, 4:01!

[Flagophile]

Omega,

You are spot on in all of your posts lately.

However, I wouldn't try to use reason and logic on this site.

Seriously, it'll make you mad.

Many of these people are incapable of a serious discussion. If it's not Bible-thumping, it's name-calling, fear-mongering, and the like.

Natural Order... Ha!!

What does that mean?

Does that mean the way that it is written in that compilation of stupid stories and fairy tales that you call "God's Word?"

[Bruce]

What's the big deal. Live and let live. People who are uptight about this issue are backward. Let's focus on a big issue - this horrible administration that is full of lies and the awful war propaganda machine they created. Now we're in a recession, but all that's OK as long as we can stop same-sex marriage. Wake up people!

[Thomas]

Go to http://www.knowthyneighbor.org to find the people you know who signed the petition.

Tell you what… I’ll make you a deal. When you can take either a gay male, or gay female couple… put them on an island with all the essentials they need to live, and give them no other human contact besides the two of them….

And…

If we go back in 100-years and find they have populated the island (aka: continued their human existence through, oh, I don’t know… say, Natural Order!)… then I’m in.

Until then… shut your pie hole and be happy you’re not in jail.

Reasonable enough for ya, Flag?

For me it has nothing to do with Gay marriage - it has to do with placing limitations on the rights of non-married heterosexual couples.

This amendment seriously curtails the right to inherit, the right to direct medical care, the right to visitation, and a wide variety of other aspects of life non-married hetero couples take for granted.

Seniors who have a companion, but don't want to be married again will find their rights curtailed.

Young couples who have a long-term monogamous relationships will find their rights curtailed.

In their attempts to impress a moral standard on all Florida residents - the proponents of this amendment did not consider all the consequences of such an absolute ban.

[Omega83]

4:13

No one is disputing your biological assumptions.

We are disputing what its relevance is to the question at hand.

Marriage is the union between two (or more in some parts of Texas) people who profess their undying love to one another.

That they can or cannot procreate regardless of sexual orientation is irrelevant. It does not change the issue of love, and should not adversely impact the love 2 heterosexuals have for one another.

So if it's all about love, then a 49 year old man who loves a 16-year old boy is ok?

[Flagophile]

4:13,

Let me see if I follow:

Are you suggesting that homosexuals should not be allowed to marry because the fact that they cannot procreate, alone, offends some "natural order?"

[Reality]

The problem with this entire situation really boils down to a couple things; the GLBT community fell right into the political issue-framers game. This argument started out as one of ‘Civil Unions” with approximately 80% nationwide support. After some polling, those opposed to the concept found a 73% disapproval of the issue as framed using the term “Gay Marriage (ala: Estate Tax versus Death Tax).

Add in the fact that Gay Marriage is an “exclusive” action that cuts out all other relationship styles, and you have the making of the perfect shut down. The GLBT community would do wise to get this issue back on track as one of equal rights for all, and Civil Unions.

[David]

Is there anyone out there who has anything intelligent to say about this subject? It isn't evident based on the comments above. I am embarrased and ashamed for all of you.

No Flag... the question was about "Natural order", combined with some sort of attack on God.

Reality nailed it!

[alan]

let the lefties go to the left coast!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

good riddance

[weird Al]

I was a Bridesmaid at a Gay Wedding.
It was very well done. One exception, was the dipping sauce for the sausage.
Otherwise it was spectacular!!!!

[Flagophile]

The slippery-slope argument fails.

Children cannot legally consent to contract and therefore cannot marry. Plain and simple.

The "soon we will be marrying dogs" argument fails for the same reason.

[Adam]

Why is everyone so concerned with the lifestyles of people the do not even know or have contact with? Just like hetero couples we work 9-5 jobs, we buy cars, houses and other goods. Whats the problem? I don't go around protesting bible thumpers who pick and choose which parts of the bible are convenient to follow (eat shrimp lately).

It is sad that there are still people as unintelligent as the posters on this page. If its against your beliefs and offends you then why did you click on this article.

Reality did nail it. That’s the exact reason none of the Presidential candidates support gay marriage, but they do support civil unions.

I don't eat shrimp and I'm not gay... I guess I'm out then.

Bye!

[Un-Natural]

My wife and I just found out that we cannot have a baby due to infertility.. I guess by that standard, we should not be allowed to have been married? That was a very weak and very offensive statement. If you put us on an island with everything we need to live, we would still be without a child. So thank you for belittling our pain in stating that we are un-natural. Just remember that God reserves all judgement. Hate is a tool of Satan. Jesus told for us to love each other and treat each other as we would like to be treated ourselves. When you stand in front of God and he (or she) asks you why you hated and persecuted a person you never met... what are you going to say? "I though that's what you wanted because a book told me too." I would much rather say, "Lord, I may not have agreed with their lifestyle, but I regarded them as my equal and loved them as my family". May God (or whatever higher power you believe in) grant you peace and love and fill you with kindness. Or is that un-natural too?

Quick survey question.

How many of you wake up every morning and think "Man those gays getting married really p_isses me off. I wish government could do something about it."

[Buzzard]

How dare they publish that information! Angry retribution cannot be far behind. I fully expect a rash of drive-by slappings. yuk, yuk, yuk.

You freaks just don't get it.

[Tee]

God has delivered a warning to the shallow-minded and hate-mongering people of Bell Shoals that perpetuate much of this hate in the Tampa area. They should heed it.

[VaJayJay]

Simply put, the government should stay out of marriage in general and only grant civil-unions to everyone. Marriage in this country is a mess, not matter what the religious right has to say. Look at the mess in Texas with the polygamists. Let me them marry a man, a women, or ten women for all I care - keep my tax dollars, and what I do in the privacy of my own bedroom out of it. Post 9-11 everyone is this country has gone stark raving mad-obsessed with religion while it divides the country and the only ones laughing all the way to the bank are the pastors with their Bentleys (Church Without Walls), their millions and their private planes. Enough is enough. Abolish the Office of Faith Based Initiatives - stay out of school vouchers and start making these churches pay some taxes so we can pay for the Republican war on Iraq abroad and personal freedoms at home!

[Marie]

Who cares if two consenting adults want to get married? Most of those against it are hypocrites anyway. They claim to "protect the sanctity of marriage" but how many have had affairs? Protect the children? How many of you smoke or drink around them?

As for religion? Yeah. Teach them the Bible. A book of psychological abuse, child abuse, incest. Really good to bring your kids up on.

evangelicalism is running rampant in this nation and is totally out of control. same-sex marriage is on its way. the evangelicals don't seem to realize the amount of damage done to their "faith" by their unholy pact with the war-mongering corporate thieves in the republican party. the only folks that are rabidly against homosexuals are the folks who struggle violently against the same sexual inclinations themselves.
"where there's smoke, there's fire." and lest i forget, please keep your religion and your dogma to yourselves. i don't want it.

Yes, let's withdraw our petition signatures.

We were under a skunk and didn't know it until our noses got hit with the smell of this amendment.

This constitutional initiative amendment is supported by some Christians who would like to exterminate homosexuals and lesbians, however such a "Final Solution" is not possible in the United States.

So this is their alternative approach.

[Omega83]

Logical Scenario...

I have a coworker who is a gay male, and has been in a monogamous relationship for 8 years. He considers his partner his husband, and wears a ring. They share all living expenses and arrangements.

He is an only child. His parents are both deceased.

Under current law, if he were to be hospitalized, his partner would not be recognized as NOK nor would he be cable to make legal, end of life decisions.

How would this amendment protect or dent him the ability to confer such estate powers and guardianship on his partner?

[Tee]

Omega83, you've hit on the very premise of the problem. If the radical right gets its way and allows this amendment, not only will Adam not be allowed into Steve's room if he is hospitalized, bury him or plan his estate (same as it is now), but it will also prevent unmarried heterosexual couples from the same. What about divorced straight people that aren't legally husband and wife anymore? Same thing. It starts a really slippery slope, and all in the name of satisfying stadium churches that don't pay any taxes, sway the vote enough in this country and can sweep their little sexual abuse scandals away with their army of attorneys. It's a big mess.

[md]

Un-Natural... you posed excellent points. It's a ridiculous argument and offensive to couples in your position. Thanks for putting this situation into a positive light without resorting to the mudslinging going on from both sides. I think your conclusion is likely what a truly compassionate God would expect... accepting all people and treating them well.

Love thy neighbor as thyself.

[Marie]

Back in the 50s people were making these comments about minorities and interracial couples. Same arguments. These religious nuts need to crawl back under the rocks they crawled out of.

GLBT lobby pushed too far beyond what is reasonable and here comes the backlash.

No we don't want uni-transexual public bathrooms, children being taught in elementary school that Heather has two mommies or any o fthat type of stuff that has no relevance to treating anyone in a decent and respectful manner.

So, when this amendment passes remember the reason it did was because the general population does not want this same sex stuff rammed down their throats or that of their children.

To David:
I have something to say, and we have talked before. Everyone has a right to love and to be loved. Their choice. Not ours. Leave them alone.

Un_natural: YOu are very right and on target. Some of the nasty comments are coming from the HIllsborough County Democratic Executive Committee Chairperson, Susan Smith. She is hateful and ugly, and will answer someday to our God for the hate she has for those who aren't like herself. Thank God for that.

I agree with 4:01 (The gay community was making great strides until they invited transexuals, transgenders, and every other freak into their big diverse tent...) One step at a time. Love is love, freak is freak.

[Chris W]

11:08 - If you're going to throw names around, at least try to get them right so you don't sound like such a gomer. For the record Michael Steinberg is the HCDEC Chair, not Susan Smith.

This amendment is such a bad idea it could only have originated in the "family values wannabe" right wing of the Republican Party and helped along to keep the fundaBaptists agitated and willing to man the phone banks and handing out leaflets come November.

You clowns are being used. Do you care?

Why do so-called "Christians" have to be so hateful and resort to biblical quotes and using religion in lame efforts to justify their emotional and ignorant positions?
I don't know why I read these threads. The hatred and bigotry makes you think we're back in the dark ages.
But maybe it's good to re-realize that these things are just a rock-turn away.
At least the recent congressional special election results help you think that even in states like Louisiana, people are rejecting that wing of so-called thought.

[Reality]

The problem with this entire situation really boils down to a couple things; the GLBT community fell right into the political issue-framers game. This argument started out as one of ‘Civil Unions” with approximately 80% nationwide support. After some polling, those opposed to the concept found a 73% disapproval of the issue as framed using the term “Gay Marriage (ala: Estate Tax versus Death Tax).

Add in the fact that Gay Marriage is an “exclusive” action that cuts out all other relationship styles, and you have the making of the perfect shut down. The GLBT community would do wise to get this issue back on track as one of equal rights for all, and Civil Unions.

10:29

the general population does not want this one religion stuff rammed down their throats or that of their children.

This includes:

- Public $ to parochial schools
- Restraints on end-of-life decision making
- Restrictions on Roe v. Wade
- Intelligent design taught in science class (Scopes was 80 years ago, neanderthals)
- Taxpayer dollars supporting Christian license plates

Given all of the above, the least the Christian Taliban could do is cede the civil unions...

[Buzzard]

Golly, calm down. 10:06 made a good point, albeit inadvertantly. It's all about terminology. I don't think most of the conservatives here would object to "civil unions" since it's pretty much just a contract that says who gets what rights under CIVIL law. Man can have civil union with a woman, another man or even a group.

But no government should have any control over the word "marriage", since it has strong moral and religious implications. And I think most of us agree there should be strict separation of church and state. Government should have the right to declare civil unions, but not marriages. They can RECOGNIZE THE CIVIL UNION created in a marriage, but they cannot connote what is a marriage.

But since there are churches of all colors and stripes, there is no doubt that some would be happy to perform same sex "marriages" for those that want it. It's your business.

And everyone on this board of both sides...just don't try to cram it down the throats of everyone who believes differently by using the word "marriage" in civil law.

10:06... dope,

"Given all of the above, the least the Christian Taliban could do is cede the civil unions..."

Given that 90% of this nation professes to be Christian (both R&D’s alike), if you keep that insulting bs up… you won’t even get civil unions.

WAKE THE HELL UP!… or continue to lose.

11:00

Dear Stupid,

The license plate failed, vouchers failed, intelligent design failed, Roe v. Wade still stands as precedent, and Terri Schiavo is D-E-A-D

PS - 2000 Census dropped those who ID's themselves to under 80%

Now...who continues to LOSE?

Want to try again, retard. I am here all week

10:06

11:26,

You are one sick and twisted homertesticle or lesbotarian. With any luck (for you), by… say… 3018, everyone in America will be either a meat whistle player or a two-can-chew!

Then, all you mean, twisted, miserable freaks can get married… of course you’ll be extinct by 3097… but hey, one has to dream!

This will pass with 68%… and you have nobody to blame but your own narcissistic selves.

[Etc]

Yuck. Hey, Times moderator...can we get back to TruckNutz?

11:47

Ooh, I hit a nerve did I?! The truth hurts sometimes - especially for proven losers. But keep on trying, hater...perhaps the reality of your inability to win in life will someday wear you down into an oblivion of unhappiness and darkness.

That will be right about the time you die, and God sentences you to eternity in Hell.

[VJJ]

It amazes me how ignorant and blind the conservative and *Christian* sects are in this country; they all share a brain because they can't think for themselves. They all identify as hard-working salt-of-the-earth Americans who can only get inspired about matters like immigration, terrorism and homosexuality, never mind the fact that the economy is in the toilet and the planet is melting (a *liberal fib* as they like to call it). I recently heard a Baptist woman crying that Jesus is burning the land in Florida because of man's sin. Sure, lady ... I am quite sure that it has nothing to do with the lit cigarette you tossed out of your car. I've also heard of conservative Christians who think they have *diverted hurricanes with prayer* from their town over to Orlando -- because it hosts Gay Days in June. At some point, you have to look at these people and wonder why we even allow them to vote, much less live here. More and more, the term *conservative Christian* conjures up images of some Citrus-country trailer park with rebel flags blowing in the breeze where supper consists of an 18-pack of Keystone Light and a carton of Marlboro Lights. Can we get these people some other books to read than the picture-page version of the Bible? At some point we just need to tell them, "I’m sorry Sir/Madam, you are clearly too stupid to vote. Please return your welfare check and go back to school."

Dear 11:26-

you didn't hit a nerve, you proved my point. Even if it was "only" 70% that's a lot of folks.

[People lover]

The Gay Marriage Amendment is hateful!!Period!! You so-called Christians, all you do is judge, judge, judge. How sad for you who miss out on the lovely people who are gay. Unfortunately, you are the ones who are one dimensional, close minded, bigoted, racist, and bitter. In the meantime, the rest of us will evolve in consciousness that Christ intended us to. Sorry that you missed the boat, you will be waiting forever, Christ already came.

[Buzzard]

Marry whomever you want with the recognition you want...in your own church, temple or happy circle. Just don't try to force your beliefs upon the rest of us, be they pro gay or anti gay through civil law. That's like telling a muslim he HAS to eat pork. The word Marriage doesn't belong in civil law. As a compromise, the phrase Civil Union does.

Exactly, Buzzard... but they just don't get it. And because of their stubbornness and arrogance about the issue, they will get exactly what’s coming to them… NADDA!

Again... This will pass with 68%… and the Bacon, Lettuce, and Tomato Group has nobody to blame but their own narcissistic selves.

[VJJ]

You mean narcissistic enough to believe that the 68% of the bought-and-paid-for signatures fraudulently obtained by conservative christians will translate into real votes? Sorry, but you won't be able to stuff those under the guise of petitioning for a hurricane fund and pandering to every little old lady that walks out of a polling place.

No, I mean narcissistic enough to believe that the general voting population thinks the biggest problem facing our nation is homertesticles and lesbotarians getting married… that narcissistic enough!

I mean narcissistic enough to believe that the general voting population isn’t sick and freaking tired of you people shoving this BS down our throats, and just might pass it by 68% as a way of shoving it right up you a_s… and to convince you to shut your freaking pie-holes about it.

2:10-
Would that theory be called:
"you catch more flies with sugar than vinegar"

[Tee]

Man Whose Name Is Always Blank:
You might want to move to Kentucky or West Virginny and secede from the Union so you can hang out with other simple-minded rednecks JUST like yourself - where you can all be hateful and ignorant and redneck together. You’ll be safe there. You can bash gays and liberals and hate blacks, muslims, Mexicans, Chinks, Indians and Jews, actors, florists, artists, hairdressers, half the staff at DisneyWorld and call each other wizard and wear white-pointy hats and burn crosses. Oh, by the way, the California Supreme Court just ruled that *bacons* have a Constitutional Right to marry. This will never pass, so I'd start *packing*...

The California ruling was bad news for the gay community because voters see the court overturning their will and want to make sure it doesn't happen.

Person Whose Name Is That of a Piece of Golf Equipment:

Thanks for proving my point.

"Tee" is just as worthless as " "

Keep hiding behind a handle if it helps you feel brave. Until you post your real name, don't critize others for the same behavior.

I think Golf is hot!

12:52

I am one of the Christian majority. However, I am also of the majority who believe in faith, forgiveness, and the ultimate authority of God's judgment superior to our own.

The Old Testament spoke to the evils of homosexuality. The New Testament offers us all salvation and forgiveness under the assumption that we ALL sin and God and only God will be our judge...it is understood to overwrite the Old Testament.

Nowhere does Christ condemn homosexuals anymore than any other group. In fact, His message of forgiveness is for us all

11:26

[Tee]

The original (pre-bastardized texts) Old Testament says NOTHING of homosexuality specifically but rather of general uncleanliness and bad morality prior to Passover. Get it right. The Bible YOU are reading has probably been so TWISTED that every other word is homosexual. Are you going to start quoting us Romans, next?

Tee,

Good luck in hell!

[Tee]

Quoting "2:31PM" ...

"Keep hiding behind a handle if it helps you feel brave. Until you post your real name, don't critize others for the same behavior."

I see "2:31PM" that you have no "homotesticles" either, because you didn't post your name.

Dang, Tee... I'm surprised you're still standing after that spin!

I get it... "But officer, hey killed someone too, after I killer someone... so I'm ok!"

... dink

Tee,

Chill out and reread what I posted about the Bible at 2:34. I think you'll find we agree...

2:34

[heterosexual]

Gays getting married. Why shouldn't they be as miserable as the rest of us?
60% of hetero marrigaes end in divorce and most divorces are pretty nasty.
The only person's sex life I really care about is my own... what's wrong with these people who care about others' personal lives.... watch more Judge Judy, I say!

[Tee]

Dang?

[Tee]

Judge Judy for president!! I am all in on that!