Attacking McCain's war service

12:41 p.m. e-mail from the Barack Obama campaign:"As he's said many times before, Senator Obama honors and respects Senator McCain's service, and of course he rejects yesterday's statement by General Clark," said Obama campaign spokesman Bill Burton.

12:56  pm e-mail from RPOF: “As a former Naval officer, I am dismayed at General Clark’s comments and appalled at Barack Obama’s refusal to reject those statements.  While Obama publicly calls for change, his campaign has signaled that it is business as usual, saying anything to get elected and allowing false attacks to stand.  I urge the Obama campaign and General Clark to do as John McCain has done: put their country first and put aside the empty rhetoric and hurtful statements,” said a statement from Former Lieutenant Glenn Boggs, a graduate of the United States Naval Academy (Class of 1968) and a former engineering officer of an ocean-going minesweeper.

Comments

Wesley Clark is an idiot who was fired by Bill Clinton of all people.

Why exactly does anyone even care what he says?

Wesley Clark is an idiot who was fired by Bill Clinton of all people.

Why exactly does anyone even care what he says?

I'm sending a thank you note to Wesley Clark from John McCain. He should be able to ride Clark's comments for a few news cycles and for some fundraising.

[Give it a rest Jimbo]

The only thing more annoying than Wesley Clark's statement is how many times Jim Greer sends out a self promoting press release.

[Bob]

I don't see how Clark "attacked" McCain's war service. He praised his service... but made the point that he doesn't know anything about commanding military operations just because he got shot down by a plane and was tortured. I guess that's why they say a "gaffe" is merely stating a political truth. I am a little disappointed that Obama denounced the comment. It's a good point.

[Flagophile]

General Clark was spot on.

I'm sick and tired of you Republican hacks saying that McCain's service in Vietnam qualifies him to be President.

Is he a patriot? Yes.

Did he make large sacrifices for his country? Absolutely.

Does spending 5 years in a prison camp thirty or so years ago make you qualified to be President? A resounding NO.

It is a non-sequitor that Republicans have repeated so many times that people have started to believe it.

[Omega83]

Go Navy. Beat Army.

[A republican with sense]

Navy pilot John Sidney McCain III should have never been allowed to graduate from the U.S. Navy flight school. He was a below average student and a lousy pilot. Had his father and grandfather not been famous four star U.S. Navy admirals, McCain III would have never been allowed in the cockpit of a military aircraft.

His father John S. "Junior" McCain was commander of U.S. forces in Europe later becoming commander of American forces in Vietnam while McCain III was being held prisoner of war. McCain III's grandfather John S. McCain, Sr. commanded naval aviation at the Battle of Okinawa in 1945.

During his relative short stunt on flight status, McCain III lost five U.S. Navy aircraft, four in accidents and one in combat.

Robert Timberg, author of The Nightingale's Song, a book about Annapolis graduates and their tours in Vietnam, wrote that McCain "learned to fly at Pensacola, though his performance was below par, at best good enough to get by. He liked flying, but didn't love it."

McCain III lost jet number one in 1958 when he plunged into Corpus Christi Bay while practicing landings. He was knocked unconscious by the impact coming to as the plane settled to the bottom.

McCain's second crash occurred while he was deployed in the Mediterranean. "Flying too low over the Iberian Peninsula," Timberg wrote, "he took out some power lines [reminiscent of the 1998 incident in which a Marine Corps jet sliced through the cables of a gondola at an Italian ski resort, killing 20] which led to a spate of newspaper stories in which he was predictably identified as the son of an admiral."

McCain's third crash three occurred when he was returning from flying a Navy trainer solo to Philadelphia for an Army-Navy football game.

Timberg reported that McCain radioed, "I've got a flameout" and went through standard relight procedures three times before ejecting at one thousand feet. McCain landed on a deserted beach moments before the plane slammed into a clump of trees.

McCain's fourth aircraft loss occurred July 29, 1967, soon after he was assigned to the USS Forrestal as an A-4 Skyhawk pilot. While seated in the cockpit of his aircraft waiting his turn for takeoff, an accidently fired rocket slammed into McCain's plane. He escaped from the burning aircraft, but the explosions that followed killed 134 sailors, destroyed at least 20 aircraft, and threatened to sink the ship.

McCain's fifth loss happened during his 23rd mission over North Vietnam on Oct. 26, 1967, when McCain's A-4 Skyhawk was shot down by a surface-to-air missile. McCain ejected from the plane breaking both arms and a leg in the process and subsequently parachuted into Truc Bach Lake near Hanoi.

After being drug from the lake, a mob gathered around McCain, spit on him, kicked him and stripped him of his clothing. He was bayoneted in his left foot and his shoulder crushed by a rifle butt. He was then transported to the Hoa Lo Prison, also known as the Hanoi Hilton.

After being periodically slapped around for "three or four days" by his captors who wanted military information, McCain called for an officer on his fourth day of captivity. He told the officer, "O.K., I'll give you military information if you will take me to the hospital." -U.S. News and World Report, May 14, 1973 article written by former POW John McCain.

"Demands for military information were accompanied by threats to terminate my medical treatment if I [McCain] did not cooperate. Eventually, I gave them my ship's name and squadron number, and confirmed that my target had been the power plant." Page 193-194, Faith of My Fathers by John McCain.

When the communist learned that McCain's father was Admiral John S. McCain, Jr., the soon-to-be commander of all U.S. Forces in the Pacific, he was rushed to Gai Lam military hospital (U.S. government documents), a medical facility normally unavailable for U.S. POWs.

The communist Vietnamese figured, because POW McCain's father was of such high military rank, that he was of royalty or the governing circle. Thereafter the communist bragged that they had captured "the crown prince."

For 23 combat missions (an estimated 20 hours over enemy territory), the U.S. Navy awarded McCain a Silver Star, a Legion of Merit for Valor, a Distinguished Flying Cross, three Bronze Stars, two Commendation medals plus two Purple Hearts and a dozen service medals.

"McCain had roughly 20 hours in combat," explains Bill Bell, a veteran of Vietnam and former chief of the U.S. Office for POW/MIA Affairs -- the first official U.S. representative in Vietnam since the 1973 fall of Saigon. "Since McCain got 28 medals," Bell continues, "that equals out to about a medal-and-a-half for each hour he spent in combat. There were infantry guys -- grunts on the ground -- who had more than 7,000 hours in combat and I can tell you that there were times and situations where I'm sure a prison cell would have looked pretty good to them by comparison. The question really is how many guys got that number of medals for not being shot down."

For years, McCain has been an unchecked master at manipulating an overly friendly and biased news media. The former POW turned Congressman, turned U.S. Senator, has managed to gloss over his failures as a pilot and collaborations with the enemy by exaggerating his military service and lying about his feats of heroism.

McCain has sprouted Navy pilot John Sidney McCain III should have never been allowed to graduate from the U.S. Navy flight school. He was a below average student and a lousy pilot. Had his father and grandfather not been famous four star U.S. Navy admirals, McCain III would have never been allowed in the cockpit of a military aircraft.

His father John S. "Junior" McCain was commander of U.S. forces in Europe later becoming commander of American forces in Vietnam while McCain III was being held prisoner of war. McCain III's grandfather John S. McCain, Sr. commanded naval aviation at the Battle of Okinawa in 1945.

During his relative short stunt on flight status, McCain III lost five U.S. Navy aircraft, four in accidents and one in combat.

Robert Timberg, author of The Nightingale's Song, a book about Annapolis graduates and their tours in Vietnam, wrote that McCain "learned to fly at Pensacola, though his performance was below par, at best good enough to get by. He liked flying, but didn't love it."

McCain III lost jet number one in 1958 when he plunged into Corpus Christi Bay while practicing landings. He was knocked unconscious by the impact coming to as the plane settled to the bottom.

McCain's second crash occurred while he was deployed in the Mediterranean. "Flying too low over the Iberian Peninsula," Timberg wrote, "he took out some power lines [reminiscent of the 1998 incident in which a Marine Corps jet sliced through the cables of a gondola at an Italian ski resort, killing 20] which led to a spate of newspaper stories in which he was predictably identified as the son of an admiral."

McCain's third crash three occurred when he was returning from flying a Navy trainer solo to Philadelphia for an Army-Navy football game.

Timberg reported that McCain radioed, "I've got a flameout" and went through standard relight procedures three times before ejecting at one thousand feet. McCain landed on a deserted beach moments before the plane slammed into a clump of trees.

McCain's fourth aircraft loss occurred July 29, 1967, soon after he was assigned to the USS Forrestal as an A-4 Skyhawk pilot. While seated in the cockpit of his aircraft waiting his turn for takeoff, an accidently fired rocket slammed into McCain's plane. He escaped from the burning aircraft, but the explosions that followed killed 134 sailors, destroyed at least 20 aircraft, and threatened to sink the ship.

McCain's fifth loss happened during his 23rd mission over North Vietnam on Oct. 26, 1967, when McCain's A-4 Skyhawk was shot down by a surface-to-air missile. McCain ejected from the plane breaking both arms and a leg in the process and subsequently parachuted into Truc Bach Lake near Hanoi.

After being drug from the lake, a mob gathered around McCain, spit on him, kicked him and stripped him of his clothing. He was bayoneted in his left foot and his shoulder crushed by a rifle butt. He was then transported to the Hoa Lo Prison, also known as the Hanoi Hilton.

After being periodically slapped around for "three or four days" by his captors who wanted military information, McCain called for an officer on his fourth day of captivity. He told the officer, "O.K., I'll give you military information if you will take me to the hospital." -U.S. News and World Report, May 14, 1973 article written by former POW John McCain.

"Demands for military information were accompanied by threats to terminate my medical treatment if I [McCain] did not cooperate. Eventually, I gave them my ship's name and squadron number, and confirmed that my target had been the power plant." Page 193-194, Faith of My Fathers by John McCain.

When the communist learned that McCain's father was Admiral John S. McCain, Jr., the soon-to-be commander of all U.S. Forces in the Pacific, he was rushed to Gai Lam military hospital (U.S. government documents), a medical facility normally unavailable for U.S. POWs.

The communist Vietnamese figured, because POW McCain's father was of such high military rank, that he was of royalty or the governing circle. Thereafter the communist bragged that they had captured "the crown prince."

For 23 combat missions (an estimated 20 hours over enemy territory), the U.S. Navy awarded McCain a Silver Star, a Legion of Merit for Valor, a Distinguished Flying Cross, three Bronze Stars, two Commendation medals plus two Purple Hearts and a dozen service medals.

"McCain had roughly 20 hours in combat," explains Bill Bell, a veteran of Vietnam and former chief of the U.S. Office for POW/MIA Affairs -- the first official U.S. representative in Vietnam since the 1973 fall of Saigon. "Since McCain got 28 medals," Bell continues, "that equals out to about a medal-and-a-half for each hour he spent in combat. There were infantry guys -- grunts on the ground -- who had more than 7,000 hours in combat and I can tell you that there were times and situations where I'm sure a prison cell would have looked pretty good to them by comparison. The question really is how many guys got that number of medals for not being shot down."

For years, McCain has been an unchecked master at manipulating an overly friendly and biased news media. The former POW turned Congressman, turned U.S. Senator, has managed to gloss over his failures as a pilot and collaborations with the enemy by exaggerating his military service and lying about his feats of heroism.

McCain has sprouted Navy pilot John Sidney McCain III should have never been allowed to graduate from the U.S. Navy flight school. He was a below average student and a lousy pilot. Had his father and grandfather not been famous four star U.S. Navy admirals, McCain III would have never been allowed in the cockpit of a military aircraft.

His father John S. "Junior" McCain was commander of U.S. forces in Europe later becoming commander of American forces in Vietnam while McCain III was being held prisoner of war. McCain III's grandfather John S. McCain, Sr. commanded naval aviation at the Battle of Okinawa in 1945.

During his relative short stunt on flight status, McCain III lost five U.S. Navy aircraft, four in accidents and one in combat.

Robert Timberg, author of The Nightingale's Song, a book about Annapolis graduates and their tours in Vietnam, wrote that McCain "learned to fly at Pensacola, though his performance was below par, at best good enough to get by. He liked flying, but didn't love it."

McCain III lost jet number one in 1958 when he plunged into Corpus Christi Bay while practicing landings. He was knocked unconscious by the impact coming to as the plane settled to the bottom.

McCain's second crash occurred while he was deployed in the Mediterranean. "Flying too low over the Iberian Peninsula," Timberg wrote, "he took out some power lines [reminiscent of the 1998 incident in which a Marine Corps jet sliced through the cables of a gondola at an Italian ski resort, killing 20] which led to a spate of newspaper stories in which he was predictably identified as the son of an admiral."

McCain's third crash three occurred when he was returning from flying a Navy trainer solo to Philadelphia for an Army-Navy football game.

Timberg reported that McCain radioed, "I've got a flameout" and went through standard relight procedures three times before ejecting at one thousand feet. McCain landed on a deserted beach moments before the plane slammed into a clump of trees.

McCain's fourth aircraft loss occurred July 29, 1967, soon after he was assigned to the USS Forrestal as an A-4 Skyhawk pilot. While seated in the cockpit of his aircraft waiting his turn for takeoff, an accidently fired rocket slammed into McCain's plane. He escaped from the burning aircraft, but the explosions that followed killed 134 sailors, destroyed at least 20 aircraft, and threatened to sink the ship.

McCain's fifth loss happened during his 23rd mission over North Vietnam on Oct. 26, 1967, when McCain's A-4 Skyhawk was shot down by a surface-to-air missile. McCain ejected from the plane breaking both arms and a leg in the process and subsequently parachuted into Truc Bach Lake near Hanoi.

After being drug from the lake, a mob gathered around McCain, spit on him, kicked him and stripped him of his clothing. He was bayoneted in his left foot and his shoulder crushed by a rifle butt. He was then transported to the Hoa Lo Prison, also known as the Hanoi Hilton.

After being periodically slapped around for "three or four days" by his captors who wanted military information, McCain called for an officer on his fourth day of captivity. He told the officer, "O.K., I'll give you military information if you will take me to the hospital." -U.S. News and World Report, May 14, 1973 article written by former POW John McCain.

"Demands for military information were accompanied by threats to terminate my medical treatment if I [McCain] did not cooperate. Eventually, I gave them my ship's name and squadron number, and confirmed that my target had been the power plant." Page 193-194, Faith of My Fathers by John McCain.

When the communist learned that McCain's father was Admiral John S. McCain, Jr., the soon-to-be commander of all U.S. Forces in the Pacific, he was rushed to Gai Lam military hospital (U.S. government documents), a medical facility normally unavailable for U.S. POWs.

The communist Vietnamese figured, because POW McCain's father was of such high military rank, that he was of royalty or the governing circle. Thereafter the communist bragged that they had captured "the crown prince."

For 23 combat missions (an estimated 20 hours over enemy territory), the U.S. Navy awarded McCain a Silver Star, a Legion of Merit for Valor, a Distinguished Flying Cross, three Bronze Stars, two Commendation medals plus two Purple Hearts and a dozen service medals.

"McCain had roughly 20 hours in combat," explains Bill Bell, a veteran of Vietnam and former chief of the U.S. Office for POW/MIA Affairs -- the first official U.S. representative in Vietnam since the 1973 fall of Saigon. "Since McCain got 28 medals," Bell continues, "that equals out to about a medal-and-a-half for each hour he spent in combat. There were infantry guys -- grunts on the ground -- who had more than 7,000 hours in combat and I can tell you that there were times and situations where I'm sure a prison cell would have looked pretty good to them by comparison. The question really is how many guys got that number of medals for not being shot down."

For years, McCain has been an unchecked master at manipulating an overly friendly and biased news media. The former POW turned Congressman, turned U.S. Senator, has managed to gloss over his failures as a pilot and collaborations with the enemy by exaggerating his military service and lying about his feats of heroism.

McCain has sprouted a halo and wings to become America's POW-hero presidential candidate

http://www.vietnamveteransagainstjohnmccain.com/cin_mccain_lost_five_u.htm

Generals in glass houses shouldn't throw stones. I wonder if Clark wouldn't mind discussing with Hispanic voters about how he stabbed Gen. Cisneros in the back for the USSOUTHCOM job.

How does Obama's zero years of military experience make him more qualified than McCain to be Commander-in-Chief?

Flag-

It doesn't in itself qualify him...it is part of the resume. It at least gives him an idea of how the military operates, which MAY be important during a time of war.

No one is suggesting that military service is the be-all end-all of qualifications...if it were, your man John Kerry would be President. But, alas, he lost.

That being said, the point here is that General Clark is a fool.

As the wife of a prominent Democrat recently stated that this "was the first time in her life she was proud of America", I recalled another prominent Democrat once writing that "many fine people have come to find themselves still loving their country but loathing the military"

Keep it up Dems - this race is yours to lose.

[Karl Rove]

If you vote for the black guy, we'll all die tomorrow! If you don't vote white,you hate our troops!

[LOOK]

http://www.vietnamveteransagainstjohnmccain.com/cin_hopper_video.htm

2:18-

no one cares about you...get over it.

[Flagophile]

That is not the point.

The point is that Wesley Clark was right on.

You all tout McCain's military experience as if being shot down and spending 5 years in a POW camp makes him more qualified to be President than Obama.

Besides unfounded, conclusory statments like "he knows how the military works," there is no proof that McCain's service helps.

Like Clark said, he was not a commander. He doesn't know a thing about general strategy, etc. Not more than Obama, at least.

Go Army, Beat navy

clark is an embarassment to everyone who yells that phrase

and no one says mccain's service alone qualifies him - strawman alert - what his service and captivity does show though is he has the type of personal character which is important for office

and besides - what the heck did obama ever do to show "executive experience"?

what the heck did obama ever do to show "executive experience"?

But, but, but....he was President of the Harvard Law Review?!!

All kneel before the Obamessiah!

"Go Army, Beat navy"

Does everything you R's do have to include a public restroom experience?

Oh yeah… cause your boys Dubya, Dickey, and McSame have done a real bang-up “executive” job so far. I guess it depends (npi) what you classify as “executive experience”… if that is helping “executives experience” wealth off the death of young American men and women for corporate profit and daddy’s revenge… then you’ve nail it!

2:37 -

It's that kind of crap why your side is rejected election after election.

2:44 -

Noooo, It's that kind of crap why your side is busted time after time.

[Flagophile]

Good. We all agree that besides a tenuous connection to McCain's "character," his military service is not really indicative of his capacity as President.

We got it.

[StaffCollegeGrad]

Ha, ha coming from the most politically connected frmr general officer in the Army, this is sheer idiocy. Gen. Clark got the top job at SouthCom because he was a Friend of Bill, both were from AK and both were Rhodes scholars. Gen Clark should take an introspective look at how he got the top job at SouthCom over Gen Cisneros, whom was a much more qualified commander and righfully in line to succeed McCaffrey. Then through his political connections, macinations and brownosing the WH, Clark makes NATO commander again over much more qualified general officers, when Clark never commanded as much as a battallion in Germany! I wonder what he wants to become now... Sen Obama, with friends like this, who needs an opponent?

Right, Flag -

No one has said that or implied that.

It is one part of a lifetime of service to his country.

We look at the candidate's experience and life as a whole, not just whether he speaks well in front of a teleprompter and looks good in a suit.

But i know you teeny-boppers out there just LOVE you some of that Obamania. He is your Beatles. We get it. It's just not how some of us choose a President.

McSame. Benedict Arnold was a military hero too, until he sold out to the enemy. Sorry, GOPers. You won't get rid of the Bush smell for a decade at least.

3:42 -

That smell was left over from Bill Clinton and will probably be there for a lifetime. Bush should have torn down the White House and started over. I at least would have burned that carpet and desk in the Oval Office.

The Obama camp is shaken that the average poll lead is only 6-ish. He got virtually no bounce from being the presumptive nominee. The mood of the country is such that they'd like a non-Republican.

HRC only appeared with Obama to help restore her image and Bill is no where to be found! They're rooting for an Obama loss so she can run in 4 years.

Shoulda picked HRC.

Yes Obama will have to deal with the Clintons undermining his candidacy at every turn.

Hillary wants to be President and she would be an old hag in 2016. This was supposed to her year and Obama "stole her show" as Father Pfleger so eloquently put it.

She does not want Obama to win. She wants to run against McCain in 2012.

3:49 Just as lame as the blather about Congress. Bush is/has torn down our economy and burned our Constitution instead. He's a totalitarian and a sell-out to Big Oil. Just as McCain now plans to be.

You mean the do-nothing Democratic -led Congress with the 13% approval rating?

That Congress? Just want to be sure we're on the same page here...

Pelosi and Reid - Wicked Witch and her flying monkey

Obama = the Wizard of Oz...a shell of a man in a suit who flies off in his hot-air balloon at the end.

Shoulda picked HRC.

4:01 You're always on the same page.

OK, so...You DO mean the do-nothing Democrat-led Congress with the 13% approval rating?

I haven’t seen the R’s this scared since they made pedophilia a crime.

Yes, the one that will become the do-something Congress when they've got an effective majority and a brand new progressive President to work with. I've got to admit, they'll have their work cut out for them, given that the out of power GOP will be hell-bent on wrecking any improvements they might attempt. Wish them luck; the future of the US will depend on them.

Yes we are scared for our kids with freaks like you around.

4:29-

You will be sorely disappointed.

[Rockabilly]

Watch: the cicadas who cry about rethugs swiftboating Obama will now proceed to ruthlessly swiftboat McCain's war service. Hypocrites and pinheads.

Obama peaked in February-March. He lost half of the primaries after that and many of them by landslides.

The more he talks, the more folks realize that he's not any different than the rest.

Without linking his website or bashing someone else, why should the American people vote for Obama on his merits?

Go to bed, Crackrock... you're embarassing yourself as usual.

[The Rock]

And you are a pinhead as usual.

Obama peaked in February-March. He lost half of the primaries after that and many of them by landslides.

The more he talks, the more folks realize that he's not any different than the rest.

Without linking his website or bashing someone else, why should the American people vote for Obama on his merits?

wes clark needs to turn in his ring so it can be melted - the disgrace

hey wes, kerry's 4 MONTHS sure sold you in 2004 - oh wait, you're not principled, you're a careerist (soldiers worst enemy) and an opportunist, so drive on

is eggs BENEDICT your favorite breakfast?

The Messiah Speaketh and throweth Wesley Clark under the bus:

"That is not the Wes Clark I know."

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20080701/D91KSSR00.html

The wheels on the bus go 'round and 'round...

McCain needs a VP. Let's get someone with a better war record and who has experience in Congress: He's a true patriot, a Navy ace, one of the first Top Gun grads, staunch Republican, a CNN political commentator, a divorcee just like McCain, a House Appropriations colleague of our own C.W. Bill Young and, BEST YET, available!

Randall "Duke" Cunningham!

But, he's also a crook and resigned in disgrace. You can contact him at the United States Penitentiary in Tucson, Arizona.