More on the refs

Lightning coach Barry Melrose said if you look at all 10 Lightning penalties called in Thursday night's game against the Islanders, "they're all penalties by the book."

By the book. That is the key phrase.

As NHL director of officiating Stephen Walkom said of maintaining the strict standard of enforcement for obstruction and stick fouls, "Honestly, I think that's our ongoing message for league consistency, that our team of officials work to the same standard every night. I think we established it after the lockout and our goal is just to maintain it. we recognize it's work every night, and we'll never be perfect, but the commitment of the guys is to work to it every night."

(View the NHL's video on obstruction and stick infractions here.)

In other words, the game is going to be called as the rules are written, and that means if a stick comes up, it's going to be called. If a player uses an open hand on another, it's going to be called regardless of how it affects the play.

Walkom said that is not a crackdown, just playing by the rules.

Melrose seems on Walkom's side here and said he is having a video made up of all the calls on the Lightning against New York, and he will show it to the players.

"Some guys think they're not penalties. They're penalties," Melrose said. "The referees and the NHL has made it clear this is what's going to be called. It's got to be a commitment thing. They (the players) have to decide winning is more important than a lazy hook or hold."

Tampa Bay entered Friday shorthanded a league-high 29 times. It is hard to argue though that referees are being stricter than years past. According to the NHL 366 restraining fouls (hooking, holding, interference, tripping, holding the stick) have been called so far this season compared to 379 last year at this time. There have been 55 slashing calls compared to 46 last season.

Still, defenseman Paul Ranger said it's difficult when a team is put two men down when contact hardly has been made.

"It's not really the way I would choose to call a game," he said.

We'll have more in Saturday's paper.

Stuff from today's practice: Lots of line dancing. Vinny Prospal was back on Vinny Lecavalier's line. And Ryan Malone as back on Steven Stamkos' line. Radim Vrbata, with zero points while playing with Stamkos, was dropped to Chris Gratton's line. Adam Hall went from Gratton's line to Stamkos'. ... Denseman Andrej Meszaros, who took a shot off his "lower body" Thursday sat out Friday's practice but is expected to play Saturday against the Wild. ... Defenseman Marek Malik has not yet signed a contract, the team said, but Melrose made it sould like Malik could play against Minnesota. We'll see, though he also said the blue line against the Islanders was the best it played all season. ... Assistant coach Wes Walz will face his former team for the first time on Saturday. ... Ranger said he had no ill effects from Thursday's game, his first of the season after April's sholder surgery. ... Melrose gave high praise to Vinny Prospal. "Vinny was the one guy who just wouldn't quit," Melrose said of Thursday's game. "Vinny went out there and was winning battles and going to the front of the net and hounding the puck. ... I thought he was awesome. I thought he was our best forward."

Comments

"Notice to all: An imposter has posted twice under my name. This has to stop."

Cute. But what the zit-faced Twinkie-d!ck with day-old Skittle bits clogging his braces who posted the above didn't know is I always spell "impostor" like so. Dimwit. (And in a few years this dork will be old enough to vote....scary)

That post is fake like all others bearing that name from now on, since as I already stated it's no longer possible to maintain any identity under a "user name" here. This is a lot like the old TBL board years ago where idiot punks would sabotage conversations and turn longtime friends against each other with the same crap until the webmaster grew a clue and fixed the software to prevent it

If I ever post any more in this forum the remarks will have to stand on their own. Best wishes to all who had nothing to do with it and to the few consistently worthwhile contributors...you know who you are

Have fun Sat. at the party, I'll be inside the Palace with a certain intensely hot foxy lady celebrating my birthday

Go Bolts

[Not the Marlboro Man]

Carolina and their coaching staff have adapted well to the new ridiculous NHL rules that awards candy @$$ play and diving. IMO the league went south at the lock out and will continue to go south until the more traditional rules and values are regenerated in the league. Step one should be good riddance to Gary Bettman. IMO Bettman doesn't have a clue and could care less about the fans, players and coaches. He's more worried about pandering to a group of potentials who could care less about the game, but they say that they would enjoy hockey allot more if there were more scoring and less violence. Yet I can't see where any of his rule changes have significantly changed the scoring and if anything has made it less enjoyable for us that have been fans for a generation or so.
Ticky tacky penalties screw up the flow of the game and make the outcome artificial. I'd rather see an even strength goal any day than some joke tapped in on a three on five. Fans don't pay to see the refs and they especially don't want the refs deciding the outcome of sporting events. The NHL hasn't got it right and until they do there will be people advocating on both sides of the matter because thats just the way it is. FIRE BETTMAN NOW!

[coach bill]

Twiner- We can usually tell when the imposter posts. His comments are insulting, classless and rarely address the topics. He's beeen usuing my "name" alot also. 'Coming Sat Night?

[the real Twinebulge]

Notice to all:

An imposter has posted twice under my name. This has to stop.

[Twinebulge]

Wow. Just....wow.

Was that called for?

IMO much bigger crybabies abound. Can't come down too hard on "Sarasota Bill" though, since anyone can post any blather they want under anyone's name they feel like, whenever they want--huge hole in the software

Everyone might as well just post anonymously from now on, if at all

[Sarasota Bill]

And apparently an ugly whiner always counts, right Chic? It really doesn't matter where or how often you post, you're the biggest crybaby around....and that's saying a lot!!!

[Hockey Chic]

Twiney thanks for the update.The particular play was heading into the attacking zone and it was at the beginning of the third period.

In fact the guy shoved him down and that is why he went into the boards hard. This was prior to him hitting the boards but the shove definitely took him out of the play and MSL did not see it coming either. I played it over and over again to see how and why he hit the boards so hard.

Thanks for the information I appreciate it. Lets get a win tonight guys. Play like a team, trust your team mate and take it to the net. An ugly goal still counts!!

Go Bolts!!!

[Do Not Panic]

This happens at the beginning of the season.The refs call the game "close" then loosen up the closer you get to the Cup.

[Twinebulge]

"Why did they not call a penatly on the guy that clearly pushed MSL into the boards. There was contact and it may not have been with a stick but contact was made. It was clearly a huge push to the ice. What is the freakin ruling on that?"

HC, I don't remember the play, but Rule 44 in Section 6-Physical Fouls concerns Checking from Behind. (Lots of people dislike rules and any discussion of them, so they can quit reading and skip this post.) The book says there is NO MINOR penalty possible for this foul, and "Any player or goalkeeper who cross-checks, pushes or charges from behind an opponent who is unable to defend himself, shall be assessed a Major Penalty. This penalty applies anywhere on the ice surface." This infraction also requires an automatic Game Misconduct penalty.

Again, I don't recall the play in question so I'm not stating it was checking from behind. Just in case it was, this is for your benefit. This rule is interesting IMO in that there is no minor penalty allowed. (But it is possible to call a major for hooking. Go figure)

[Boltflasher]

I think on this issue Barry has the correct attitude. Whether or not you agree with the way the game is being called by the refs, then understand what is being called and don't do it instead of whining like a previous coach...a constant stream to the penalty box against the Wild will be a disaster. Can not have tired players trying to keep up with the quick Wild...

[Hockey Chic]

Morning Fellow Posters lol that is for you David.

Anywho I watched the game again last night and my question is this. Why did they not call a penatly on the guy that clearly pushed MSL into the boards. There was contact and it may not have been with a stick but contact was made. It was clearly a huge push to the ice. What is the freakin ruling on that?

I do not think the fans are whinning I think we want fair and equal treatment. I hate to say this but I think Melrose had the right idea with the tape and the examples of what will be called.

That being said Melrose needs to make sure he tells his players he has their back and that he is not siding with the refs but that he just wants clarity as to what will be called.

This has been on going with the NHL officials for at least three years that I can recall so lets know the rules and play the game and as long as we know we are a step ahead.

Go Bolts!!!

[Chill the heck out]

Listen, stuff is not ideal here for sure. There's a direction, and it's not like any team is incapable of a bad start. The Ducks got out of the gate 0-4. Before you whiners jump off the skyway, give this team 15 more games to get to know each other in game situations. You've gotta be giving yourselves headaches with all this panic. Take a nap.

That would be a rare two team shutout

[keith]

While I think it was time for Torts to leave when he did, its interesting to think back, and not to long ago, that under Torts' discipline style, the Lightning were often the least penalized team in the league. What has changed?
Whine all you want about the refs (its a hockey perrenial)but there have been two teams on the ice when TBL have recently been so penalty prone. Whether the "renewed" clampdown compromizes the game....thats another discussion.

[Casper]

Memo and a question for the Wild West Show acting as the brain trust for our Club:

Did the bloody New York Rangers bag a shutout last night using their BACKUP goalie???????

Barf, again.

[Twinebulge]

If we see our sport being dragged down the tubes by ridiculously poor officiating--or good officiating based on ridiculously poor rules--it's going to come up here. That call on Ranger to make it a 5-on-3 was completely ridiculous and not in the spirit of the game. I'll give coach Melrose the benefit of his years of professional experience and concur that that foul and the others called were indeed penalties "by the book." What we're saying is, the BOOK needs to be altered slightly. It needs to ALLOW the referees discretion in calling fouls that have zero effect on the play and cause zero impediment to the opposing player.

Now, the other side of the argument is that the referees have proven themselves over the years to be inept fools so utterly incompetent in exercising discretion that the rules had to be made cookie-cutter and draconian in order to get any type of consistency. Fine, that's a valid point. There can still be discussions about rule tweaking, and about how it RUINS THE GAME for the fans and players alike to have these constant stoppages for ticky-tack fouls based on unavoidable incidental contact.

Speaking of consistency and incidental conatact, why is so much of that incidental contact allowed with the goaltender--even in his crease--and if no goal is scored, it's no penalty? ("No harm, no foul.") That's the way the rule is written. Why not apply that same concept all over the ice? Simply TOUCHING another player with your hand is NOT HOLDING. Not one hockey person I know, player or fan, thinks it is either. Why not let it go if no impediment to movement whatsoever has occurred?

Because this is the NHL, and it would make too much sense.

[Steve]

Why do some fans have trouble listening to an honest coach? Our team has taken too many stupid, lazy penalties, period. To the Sens fan, I watched that game, and Picard looked terrible. Phoenix was towards the end of a road trip and it showed. Kuba has looked decent, but he did in his first year here also. I wouldn't change a thing on that trade.

[Thunderstruck]

Yes, the calls they're making may look mighty cheesy...I agree completely. But what are you going to do? Are you going to learn from experience as to what you can and can't get away with and then do your best to avoid giving them reason to put you in the box, or are you going to try and fight the NHL all year long and spend a high amount of minutes on the PK? That is what Melrose is getting at and if you can't see the logic behind it then I don't know what to tell you.

[da bear]

KUBA WATCH 2008/09

2 assists and a +3!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
hmmmm tied for the lead league for d-men. 1pp point

1 assist for picard. on the pp

THANK-YOU TBAY!!!!

oh yeah we won 6-3.

[Graham]

I have no time for people who complain about officiating. You get a call against you in this game and one for you in the next. It evens out. Period.

Plus, Ranger turned that guy around in the corner. I would have called it even if it meant going two men down.

[danger]

I've never had much recpect for Melrose, he's a silver-tounged Hollywood type (which is probably why he was hired in the first place), but I was willing to give him a chance. But to side with the refs is outrageous. He's alienating his players and calling them "lazy", because they're getting called for bogus penalties while battling for pucks? That's one thing Torts wouldn't even do. Most of those calls last night were chincy calls that did not HAVE to be made. Hockey is a contact sport and although I agree with limiting the clutching and grabbing, how can you call stick on stick contact slashing? Let the players play. People want to see goals, but when you're calling a penelty every 3 minutes it bogs down the game. There's no flow and there's no excititment, if I wanted to see a stoppage in play every 2 minutes I'd watch a football game.

[Ted]

Pat Burns.

[Raymond]

So how is this Melrose experiment working out?

Think Oren is still happy with his new toy or do you think that maybe he should have hired someone who knows something about hockey?

[Bill Berg]

Barry is correct! That was one Prospals better games of his career if not the best. All of you BOLT fans reaaly should give the NEW TEAM and management some more time to put it all together. They need 6 more games and then lets see how they are playing and reacting to there new Coach and system.GO BOLTS