Diminished ice time

Before we get to that subject, just a moment to credit defensemen Andrej Meszaros and Lukas Krajicek. Meszaros, wearing a full mask to protect his stitched up lips and mouth, played 25:38 with a blocked shot. Krajicek, who has been bothered by a finger injury, played a season-high 24 minutes and blocked two shots.

Their participation in Sunday's 4-1 victory over the Thrashers allowed Ty Wishart to be scratched and Paul Ranger (upper body) to have another day off. With Wishart and Vladimir Mihalik, going back to AHL Norfolk, it's pretty much assured that Ranger will be ready for Thursday's game at the Coyotes.

Just one more housekeeping thing: forward Paul Szczechura was scratched because of a left leg problem that he said has been lingering for a while. With the three days off, coach Rick Tocchet said it was a "no brainer" to sit him on Sunday. The hope is he will be ready for Thursday.

Anyway, back to the point of this blog. Did you notice that Tocchet did not use the MVP line on the game's first power play? A message for the lead line on a power play that was on a 5-for-56 streak? And how about the wakeup call when Steve Eminger scored with assists from Jussi Jokinen and Adam Hall?

Tocchet said he was using whatever line was up, and he will continue to do that in the near future, he said. He said it is part of a "mental break" for his top three forwards. That seemed to extend to the rest of the game as well, to a certain extent as Vinny Lecavalier played just 16:13, more than four minutes below his average. Marty St. Louis (who had two goals and has five and 12 points in his past eight games) played 15:37, almost six minutes down; and Vinny Prospal played 14:43, about four minutes down.

When asked about it, St. Louis said, "Obviously, we haven't scored on the power play, so, you know, it is what it is."

What it is, is simply something to keep an eye on.

Oh, and I just wanted to pass this quote along from Thrashers coach John Anderson, whose team fell behind Tampa Bay into the Southeast cellar: "Our give-a-crap level is at zero. ... I got to question whether anybody cares in that locker room right now. It's a joke."      

Comments

[PD]

“PD at 1:28pm you wrote 42 million is definitely on the table. Please don't tell me there are two PD's.”

Sure Ajax, if you could read I said my guess was 8- 10 mill but having it drop to 42 is not off the table. What’s so hard to understand about that sir? Who knows where the bottom is. I don’t.

Canwest wrote the article nailing it with 40-42, not me.

“Then you talk about Vinny and in midstream say no one will touch him at age 39 with a high cap?? What?? Talk about changing the subject, everyone on the blog thought you meant he wasn't tradeable "now" Silly us, cause surely that "IS" what you meant.”

Uh no Ajax, you were 100% in error quoting me the Tampa cash payout to Vinny as a cap figure, when in fact the cap is crazily back ended concretizing my point that the guy is untradeable.
At 39 his hit is 7.5 million, nice. You should be totally embarrassed for not knowing that.

He has a poison contract.

Were you not to give me a list of Gms willing to line up for that? Please do.

Anytime you want to revisit your opinion that NHL attendance is up not counting the Hawks, I’m all ears.

[Patrick]

PD,

Vinny is going to be an unrestricted free agent when he is 41, so he will not be counting 7.5 mil against the cap when he is 41, 42. So as I said, you were stretching the facts as usual.

Regardless, if your point is that he is not tradeable, my reply is Hooray! I've never wanted him to be traded.

8-10 years from now, 7.5 mil might not be that big of a hit on the cap. It's possibly going to go down in the next couple of years, but it could easily rise up higher than it is now by the end of his contract. Again, regardless, I'm not going to fret that we have a stud player like Lecavalier who is only 28 and possibly not even in his prime yet locked up. I'm going to enjoy it.

[Boltflasher]

Just some thoughts: It is hard to believe that Len and OK, who have made themselves into millionaires, suddenly have no idea how to handle their money and finances and have gone into this unprepared to pay the first installment.

I and PD have mentioned the upcoming cap problems. I did so to show that the league itself has some issues that are somewhat separate from the Lightning, that the lifetime contracts will be a problem (as its stands now) and that other teams have some greater financial issues than this one and the rumours about the Bolts are just that, rumours...I have not seen or read anything that provides credible information (only innuendo and/or wishful rumour)of the Lightning being in any imminent financial danger or collapse. (I also think some Canadians mix up Tampa and Florida in some of the rumours, such as attendance where Tampa has easily outdrawn the stinkin' Panths)

Most articles are talking a possible cap reduction in 2010...but it doesn't mean it will happen...yes, Ajax, the league would probably have some significant discussion about it prior to such a happening. I think the league will try very hard to stabilize all franchises, including Phoenix, before relocating or worse, imploding a team. Each team in the league is worth about 200 million each (according to Forbes)and I can't imagine an owner being told we are going to throw your 200mill investment right into the toilet and contract your team.

I also think Palace would work with OK on their payments before taking back the team if a payment is missed. If they wanted the team, they would not have tried to sell it to start with...

[ajax]

PD at 1:28pm you wrote 42 million is definitely on the table. Please don't tell me there are two PD's. Then you talk about Vinny and in midstream say no one will touch him at age 39 with a high cap?? What?? Talk about changing the subject, everyone on the blog thought you meant he wasn't tradeable "now" Silly us, cause surely that "IS" what you meant.
I have no idea what the cap will drop to. Bet ya lots of bucks I am closer at 2 than you are at 10. But, You missed my point. If the cap drops steep, they will make an adjustment, if not we will have two tier hockey. Many good players will be off to Europe for a year or two. My point is the same as always. You drop these negative bombs and think there is no way out. I'll play along though. Barrie and Koules are broke. Let's say You are 110% right (as usual) Do you think they just noticed that this morning?? If they are sweating it out, maybe just maybe they find another buyer?? another partner??? They leverage 10/20/50% of Bear Mountain. Let's see, maybe they sell the team at a discounted 170 million and poof they lose only 30 million instead of 100 million. No, time after time you are the ear to ground predicting that they turn the keys over on January 16th to Palace. Could you stop printing that and show just a little bit of entrepreneur foresight?? PD did it ever dawn on you that in worst worst worst case scenario they sell the team they bought for 200 million for even lets say 150 million and in one swipe of the pen cut their losses by 50 million. That is .00001% worst case. Stop writing they are turning the keys back over. This is big business, with teams of lawyers etc etc. They ain't dummies and both have accumulated small fortunes. And day after day you predict they will lose 100 million in less than a year. Like I said, do you really believe half of what you print???

[PD]

Please don't try to put words in my mouth Ajax that makes me also sound like a baffoon.

I never said 42 million, significant others have including Canwest syndicated. I said approx. 8-10 million drop, read and apologize.

You said a laugable 2 million

On your understanding of Lecavaliers contract, as only you could assert with such certainty, again my friendly..YOU'RE Wrong. Look it up. The guys untradeable.

Your quoting me the teams pay out which works great for them if he craps out early, they have paid him.

Try quoting the cap pay which no sane GM in the league will touch. The cap is back ended.

Same for you Pat.,

I stand by everything I said.

Woeful Ajax, try harder.

[ajax]

PD, the man of half truths and 110@ dread and doom. I will respond to your doom and gloom and as usual by day's end you will be the only one believeing all of your half truths. I have read more than a few articles, ranging from, no change to the cap, to estimates of 2 million, you have seen them higher. PD in your infinite wisdom think out your statement. Cap going down to 42mil?? PD that statement sums up everything about you. Always the worst case scenario. If their was no give by the union every team would have to have 10 minimum wage players. It would kill all the 2nd and 3rd line players. They would compromise PD and the world would move on. My point was, smart business people will adjust, they won't throw in the towel like you think everyone does. So IF The cap goes down 10 million?? THEN, Everyone loses especially the players. Do you think just maybe the wise people of the world would set a meeting and figure out a win win?? No, you just see as it really hurting clubs especially the Lightning and Vinny. Smart people figure things out. They comprommise. They look for ways out. "Solutions" You never ever do that. Someday, maybe you will see possibilities for good, opportunities for success, room for growth and change. You are the eternal pessimist about everything. Every stroke of your pen is "worst case" Even if it was worst case, they would make adjustments. Do they want 50-100 players going to Europe?? The bumpy road would find a way to smooth it out.
NExt, Attendance is up 1.5% across the NHL. It had a record October. That is a fact PD. Sorry can't change the facts. That is approx. 2.5 million fans. Chicago is up about 250,000 assuming they sell out the rest of the year. I think you are a little off on that rant as well. ESPN back in the mix next year??. Is that a bad thing PD. Why is ESPN interested PD. Cause there are alot of positive's that they see. Those words must cut ya deep PD...
And last. Boyle will be almost 38 by the end of his contract??? Vinny will be 38 when the big money drops to nothing for the last three years. See the parallel. Of course you won't. Rafalsi Redden Lidstrom Campbell Briere, all of those guys above will be 36 or older by the end of their huge contracts. All dummies I guess. All untradeable. The last three years of Vinny's ccontract he makes 6.5 million total, in 2016!! I don't think that will scare the big money teams away PD. Think son, think. Only your prejudice allows you to think that Vinny couldn't be traded. Insane 110% false statement as usual.
The league is in doom, Barrie is broke, 52 goal scorer Vinny should be in the AHL, and let's bring back last years cast with Jay driving and Torts screaming at a bunch of deaf players. Yeah give me some more lessons PD. You have a one student class. Every subject you touch is worst case, from A to Z. I know you really really believe it, I wish I could help ya. The sun was out today PD, put away your umbrella.

[Patrick]

PD,

You are one of the worst when it comes to getting the details right. The facts are never enough for you, you always embellish them to make picture sound worse than it is.

"tell me again which particular GM is ready to pay Vinny Float 7.5 million a year at age 35, at age 37, at age 39, at age 42. Pick one Ajax, anyone. Richards has an end date on his contract."

Looking at Vinny's contract on nhlsalaries.com, He'll be making 7.5 mil when he's 37. He's then make 4 mil when he's 38, 1.5 mil at 39 and 1 mil at 40. You are way off as usual.

The worst part is him getting 10 mil at 36 years old and that's certainly not good. But that's like 8 years from now. While guessing at the future sure passes the time, no one knows that the state of the global economy, the nhl or the lightning will be at that point. Locking up a player of Vinny's talent for the rest of his career is of course going to be extra.

[PD]

Mike 13 anyones guess at the bottom but 42 million is definately on the table.
Not a great time to be a free agent , thats for sure. Some great deals to be had by those with cap space.

I bet Hossa is kicking himself, Gaborick too.

[Mike13]

Just to add something to the Ajax versus PD show, I found this article by Spector (Lyle Richardson) on the traditionally conservative Fox Sports website.

http://msn.foxsports.com/nhl/story/9017992/Most-top-teams-facing-free-agent-cash-crunch

"Next season's cap isn't expected to deviate much from the current $56.7 million but could drop significantly for the 2010-11 season to perhaps $50 million, creating significant cash crunches for three of these teams over the next two seasons."

The three teams he refers to are the Detroit Red Wings, Boston Bruins, and Washington Capitals.

[Mike13]

A minor note PD, you said 8-10 million. 20% is right around 10.8 million. So, the author of that article is not projecting that much more than your earlier post.

[PD]

Flasher you got that right, big time.

[PD]

Ajax with each every gigabyte, your true ignorance of hockey reality is starting to just jump out.

Like I make this stuff up.

If you really want your morning to rocket, just go to the non PD Google and type in NHL Salary Cap 2010

From there, Let's dissect your BS paragraph by paragraph, just for fun:

1/"Ajax says:IF, Big Big if, they drop the cap by what PD writes (2-3 million is much more realistic than the 8-10 million) financial "things" would change fast, and it wouldn't necesaarily be all negative.(PD, being PD) PD you truly amaze me with some of your "eye popping" statements"

NHL Cap crunch expected in 2010
Tony Gallagher, Canwest News Service
Published: Wednesday, December 24, 2008
Given the tough economic climate, any NHL free agent looking for more than a one-year deal this summer will be in tough.
If the salary cap should come down by 20 per cent or more to the $42-44 million US range, many teams -- including a lot of the traditional big spenders -- simply won't be in the hunt for anyone.

Read that Ajax?? I suggested a conservative 8-10, many are saying 20 just so you know.

How's that for an ole eye popper?

2/Ajax " No one would take Vinny??. There are 5-10 teams that the cap is a joke to. SO let's follow, Someone took Brad at 7.8 million cap, but no one will touch Vinny. Where do you get these "facts" Back to the cap drop, if by some .0001 chance that the cap drops that much, the CBA will probably get adjusted."

UM wise one, tell me again which particular GM is ready to pay Vinny Float 7.5 million a year at age 35, at age 37, at age 39, at age 42. Pick one Ajax, anyone. Richards has an end date on his contract.

http://mapleleafshotstove.com/index.php/2009/01/04/recession-relocation-and-retraction/#comment-12304

3/Ajax says" By the way attendance is up in the NHL league wide and I have read numerous times that ESPN is interested in NHL hockey again. They are interested for one reason, hockey is on the upswing nation wide."

Try Chicago Ajax, not the league
While attendance through Nov. 10 is up 1.2 percent, the entire increase is because of a phenomenal turnaround in Chicago. There has been a whopping 65.6-per-cent upsurge in the Windy City, where Rocky Wirtz has proved that father doesn't know best. Rocky's dad, Bill Wirtz, refused to televise home games because he thought it would eat into the live gate. Rocky, who recognized TV is free advertising for the club, has put the games on the tube and has seen a string of standing-room-only crowds at the United Centre. The Blackhawks are averaging 21,351, which means they've eclipsed the Canadiens for the highest average attendance in the NHL.

Tampa Bay leads the league in lost attendance down 3000 per game from last year

Get a clue before you spout your misunderstandings Ajax, I’m not the cause of your problems.

After you grab the macro picture Ajax, you can open your eyes to the OK financial disaster, but heh one lesson a day.

[Joe]

If the cap goes down i believe current contracts are reduced whatever % the cap goes down kinda like the 1st year of the cap when there was already contracts in place.

I could be wwong but i seem to remember something like that. So if the cap were to go down 5% i believe all the current contracts are reduced 5%.

Anyone else heard that or am i just remembering wrong?

[Mike13]

The reason Washington has all that depth is because they stunk badly, and I mean VERY BADLY, for 3-4 seasons. They traded away a ton of high-end players like Gonchar, Jagr, Nylander, and others to build that depth. They were not a team in denial about rebuilding. Big Ted and GMGM made it known they were going to stink and that they were building something for the future.

If we want that kind of depth, we will need to stink it up just like they did --and trade away high-end talent, and most importantly, not be a team in denial about rebuilding.

I don't think 'the cowboys' want to do that. Therefore, the Bolts will struggle while rebuilding, like so many other teams in the league.

[ajax]

IF, Big Big if, they drop the cap by what PD writes (2-3 million is much more realistic than the 8-10 million) financial "things" would change fast, and it wouldn't necesaarily be all negative.(PD, being PD) PD you truly amaze me with some of your "eye popping" statements. No one would take Vinny??. There are 5-10 teams that the cap is a joke to. SO let's follow, Someone took Brad at 7.8 million cap, but no one will touch Vinny. Where do you get these "facts" Back to the cap drop, if by some .0001 chance that the cap drops that much, the CBA will probably get adjusted. The players would be idiots not to. IF the cap goes down 8-10 million, everyteam will look like what we did, 10 minimum wage players per team. Remember with the new CBA, the payers took a off the top slice right off the bat. IF the world ends and it does drop 15-20% they will make it work. Many options for the league, not just the worst case scenario that you paint in every single blog. Vinny could be traded by noon tomorrow I guarentee it. By the way attendance is up in the NHL league wide and I have read numerous times that ESPN is interested in NHL hockey again. They are interested for one reason, hockey is on the upswing nation wide. That is good news for hockey fans, not doomsday. PD, you probably have been telling everybody for 5 years the stock market would go down, finally it did and you are "so right" IF you print enough doomsday blogs, sooner or later one of them might come true. Great way to face the morning. Yikes.

[Boltflasher]

PD, you and I are the only ones here who note the upcoming cap problems. Kudos to you on that...all the lifetime contracts will problems in 2010...

[Patrick]

Leo,

How about Dallas being a bigger disappointment. They went far into the playoffs last year and might not even get in this year. Who was expecting that?

And I guess the leaves were just expected to suck again this year?

How often does a team earn the #1 overall pick and then have a winning season the next year? Some members of this blog were thinking the free agent signings were going to be a quick fix, but many on this blog were cautiously optimistic, myself being one of them. That being said, I did expect them to be better than this.

[leo]

PD?
All of yehs, in fact.
Never, EVER, tell me about Mr.Gainey. Never, EVER, tell me what Mr.Gainey's GONNA do with my Boys or what problems he might have, contract-wise. Y'all'll never, EVER, know my Boys the way I know my Boys. Don't tell me about my Boys.
I'll tell you.
Ain't gonna be no problems. All We need is Komo; rest is replaceable. How's that?
What problems?
Thanks.
Peace.

[PD]

Love the desire to win L., Gainey though might look at a team suicide contract a little diffently..even if it was a give away.

He doesn't have enough problems to deal with next year?

Check this out
http://mapleleafshotstove.com/index.php/2009/01/04/recession-relocation-and-retraction/#comment-12304

[leo]

Agree about Cherry being a dinosaur on LOTSA subjects. But he's very insightful on others and to ignore ALL of it cuz you dislike SOME of it isn't a reason to disregard the guy.
And I'm French!
What can I say? Love the guy's comedy.
I don't think he was too harsh to tell you da trute.
As for the "biggest disappointment" thing, think he was referrin' to the expectations and the hoopla surroundin' your rebirth at the start of the season, the promises made and the circus it quickly became.
The Isles? Did anyone expect MORE outta them this year? They got Our Boy Streit and nothing else! C'mon. The Isles aren't "disappointing"; they're playing at OPTIMAL efficiency.
Same thing with Atlanta. Are they "disappointing" you? Thought they were going all the way, didjehs? C'mon.
The Sens? The Sens last won a game exactly ONE YEAR AGO. They've been sliding ever since. And not only have they NO defense (like you), they have NO GOALIE (unlike you). Yes, they're disapponting but they're the OLD disappointment; you're the NEW one.
Think that when Cherry says "biggest", you should know that it's only "biggest" until his next show. And then something ELSE will be "biggest".
What do I think? Think this turned into a circus so early in the season, that it's not even worth crying over anymore. Just get rid of thise stupid cowboys and you'll be well on your way, imo.
Think PITTSBURGH is the "biggest disappointment" right now.
And I LOVE it!
Penguin suckers.
P.

[Brittany]

Joe, I have been paying attention to our minor system this season as well and I think you pretty much nailed it.

We have a few defensive prospects (Rogers, Mihalik, Smaby, Wishart, Quick) that have a lot of potential. I would say the last thing we need is another young d-man, unless we are talking Hedman or Cowen in this next draft.

We have some quality goaltending prospects in Ramo, Helenius and now Tokarski. I think Ramo was sort of pouting after being sent down to the AHL when he thought he should be in the NHL. His last two or so games before he got the call up to backup Smitty he started to get his game back and I think realized he really needs to carry an AHL team for a season before he can be given the reigns at the NHL level. I think you will see Ramo as the backup next year, with Helenius as the main guy in the AHL and a veteran there to help him out (kinda like McKenna is there right now with Ramo) and Tik will get some time in the ECHL. (Anyone watch Tik tonight in the gold medal game? That kid brings his game in big time situations. I know he has been a bit shaky so far, but tonight he was great I thought. Sure does have a lot of heart and battles out there. Really glad we got him in the 5th round. I bet he surprises a lot of people in the future.)

Our shortcoming would be in the forward position. We have a few (which we have been able to see in their recent call ups), but outside of Chewy, Smolenak, Downie and Tyrell we are pretty much dry.

If you check out our drafting in previous years, you will see that we have been terrible. Very few guys we have drafted have made it to play in the NHL. We also had a tendency of trading our draft picks away under the old regime. I think the new guys are trying to stockpile draft picks and bring in some guys for our minor league system, but it is going to take some time. This is the biggest problem with our organization, we simply have no depth. To continually have good teams, you need to build from within, and as everyone can see, we have been downright pathetic at this throughout our history. This is why we are in the situation we are currently in. To try and have a competitive team on the ice, the owners tried to buy wins. I think their goal was to have a competitive team while they worked on fixing the minors and building a team the right way, but it didn't work out at all. I guess only time will tell if they can succeed in doing this, but I do think they at least see we have obvious problems there.

[leo]

PD,
Even if the cap were cut in half and Vinny suddenly developed polio, We'd STILL jump through hoops to get him.
Can't speak for other teams of course.
But I GUARANTEE YOU that if TB calls Us about Vinny, they'll find a dance partner.
Now since that is so, he can't be "untradeable", now can he?
Can't speak for other teams.
Just give US a ring, wouldja?
P.

[PD]

Brittany I'm with you. Have known Cherry a long time. Great guy but a dinosauer walking. His act is getting very old.

[PD]

StevR on V4 being traded. You are right he is untradeable but the reason is because of a factor no one here seems to have a clue about.

Leo disappointed in you on this.

The cap in 2010, the year after next is going to tumble badly, 8-10 million.
8 teams are at the cap right now.

No one will be taking on a lifetime 7.5 million dollar contract. Vinny wanted a contract for life and he has it.

Goes for Malone too..Bolt for 7 years

The teams that will rocket are the ones that have planned for it.

[Brittany]

Thanks for the lowdown leo.

Cherry also said the reason we were last in the league was because we were dressed "like thugs who will steal your hubcaps" (I ask, who actually steals hubcaps??) and then went on to imply that Meszaros and one of his old Ottawa teammates were going to "make some love" because they were talking with each other before the game (could he be any more racist against non-Canadians?). To say that he is a bit dramatic is an understatement. And really, I think Cherry is the last person on this planet who can make any comment on someone else being dressed foolishly. Has he looked in the mirror lately?

I wouldn't say we are the biggest disappointment in the league, we just aren't a Canadian team (like Ottawa, look how terrible they have been) and easy to pick on because we have unconventional owners.

[Joe]

I have to admit until recently I didnt realize how much work our entire organization needed from top to bottom.

When I was watching the Capitals game and they talked about how many players were playing that were called up from the minors. The bolts have to work towards getting some organizational depth like that.

This year is the first year ive paid attention to minors and juniors.

It appears we do have some you talent coming up on the blue line: Wishart,Smaby,Mihalik.

Some talent at forward: Tyrell and Downie but we need some more. I think forward is where we are most in need.

Goalie: I like Ramo but I think Helenius is the future more so then Ramo. Ramo has some pretty bad numbers in the AHL this year when he should be dominant if he is in fact NHL ready. Tokarski seems to have some talent as well but he is still very young. Would like to see him at ECHL/AHL next two years soo how he develops.

What do you guys think?

[hockeytalkie]

ben, i've noticed Hall as well the last few games. and Eminger is like a defensive version of Halpurn; not flashy they just do their job.

[Tackleberry]

As much as Cherry has been around the NHL, he does like to be a bit dramatic. Yes, the team has had a rough start with Melrose, Europe, etc.... Yes, TB has problems.

"They're (TB) the biggest disappointment in the league."
Don Cherry. With that statement, what are NYI, Atl and Ottawa?

More rebuilding in late Jan.

[Boltflasher]

http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Jon-Jordan/News-from-Norfolk-Volume-9/90/18704

[Boltflasher]

Be sure to check Jon Jordan's column on the Bolts AHL team...things are improving there...Steve Downie and, surprise, Mike Lundin, are tearing it up down there as the team went 5 and 2. Downie has 28 points in 19 games, and Riku Helenius has .914 save percentage.

Also, Dustin Tokarski starts for Canada in the gold medal game with Tavares vs Hedman as well...

The ownership has improved the minors significantly from last year at least...

[Patrick]

Leo,

That was an interesting read, thanks for posting it. A lot of it sounds familiar, but it's also good to hear it from someone like Cherry.

I don't know about the biggest disappointment in the league though, seeing as how we were in last place last year.

[Ben bolt fan]

everytime you turn around, Adam Hall is in the middle of something good. He works all the time and should be rewarded with more ice time. Eminger is starting to become one of my favorite players. He is five times better than Carlye, and actully plays defense. Great to see a contribution from the second line (finally). Halperen has been slow to get into the flow, for obvious reasons. Pettinger is still a good player for this team but keep Hall on the ice. This guy can play!!!

[leo]

Just finished listenin' to Cherry's Grapevine.
He asked "What's wrong with Tampa?
They hire Melrose, and Barry, he doesn't even have a training camp! They don't get together, they don't inplant a system...and they go overseas! With all the new guys on the team, they think going to Europe is going to be a bonding experience but you know with the hectic schedule they had over there playing those european teams as well as the two against the Rangers, they had NO TIME to jell into a team! The new players didn't even PRACTICE with each other before being thrown in against the Rangers!
Then, Barry ranks'em out after their games over there which wasn't very smart either. They don't need that kind of pressure.
Speaking of pressure, look what they're doing to this Stamkos kid, with all the billboards around town saying 'Do you know who Steve Stamkos is?' This isn't Sidney Crosby or Alex Ovechkin, folks! You're putting too much pressure on him.
Anyway, they fire the coach, ok, and they're starting to feel a bit better about themselves and then comes that game where in overtime, St-Louis hits the post and then the guy comes in on Smith and Smith makes the save but drops his stick!
The refs think he threw it! And they have to go with what they saw because the play can't be reviewed. And they lose the game. The crowd walks out with their tail between their legs.
Everything they're doing is wrong. Even when they get it right, it blows up in their face.
How you can have Lecavalier and St-Louis on a team that is the lowest scoring team in the NHL is a disgrace.
They're the biggest disappointment in the league."
Don Cherry.
P.

[keith]

Vinny aint going anywhere. Fantasy team management has some of the above guys deluded between reality and winning the pot 'o bucks in the office pool. He IS TAMPA BAY and long may it be so. Every blog has to have a whipping boy to make it more entertaining and viable. How boring would it be if every day we all agreed and praised, although I have not checked SHARKS or RED WINGS blogs in a while.

[Steve-O]

Gotta say that some of ya'll are just whacked.

(("BUT, imagine what you could get in trade for him? Top blue liner(s) AND draft pick(s). Point-wise, he is not doing well. He is only on pace for about 70pts."))

Since when is only 70 points bad? This team is not trading away 70 points when there is no way to replace them, especially when those points are the face of the team.

Anybody remember the turnover this summer where we sent a lot of people away and brought in a lot of new faces. Are we going to do it again in January? What top Blueliner are we going to get and are we going to give V4 to get him? Draft picks??? Isn't our defense incredibly young already? I am thinking the cowboys learned a bit of a humiliating lesson and will be a bit more cautious at the deadline. One or two small trades maybe, but nothing monumental. They can't be that stupid, right???

Somebody wants Roberts(hurt and announced retirement)?

[Patrick]

Nan,

I agree with you and the others who don't want Vinny traded. Yeah he's not perfect and has a huge contract, but he's shown that he can earn that money, even if he isn't playing up to that level this year. He is coming off his first major surgery as far as I know and the whole team is not scoring well - we're in the bottom 5 in scoring overall I believe. The change to a less aggressive system is probably part of that. He also just signed that massive contract - Marty and Brad also had down seasons after they signed their big contracts.

If he's going to have a down year, I'm fine with it being a year we're almost certain to miss the playoffs. I think next year he will be back to form, if not the second half of this season.

I am also against trading Ranger - he's still young and sometimes it takes 3+ years for defensemen to completely figure it out. He's probably just not ready for the role or the amount of minutes he's been forced to assume this year.

[hockeytalkie]

ranger may be the only one of those listed staying. if it lands them a D man, jokinen, roberts (a.k.a. a bag of pucks) will get thrown in a deal too

[Joe]

V4 and MSL are going nowhere. Id have no problem shipping out Prospal again. I like Prospal but he has trade value.

Here is who i feel can or should be dealt because they have value.

Prospal
Recchi
Ranger
Gratton

I like all these guys but like i said in an earlier post this is a rebuilding year. So lets rebuild!

[Nan]

I am not sure why some of you bloggers continue to insist upon trading Vinny when he won't be going anywhere. As I already stated in a previous post, that would be financial suicide for this organization for a few years, not to mention losing a lot of points by moving him. I agree with you Leo, I think Montreal would gladly take him even with that contract. V4 doesn't want to go anywhere and neither do most of the fans want to see him going anywhere.

I must be watching a different V4 than many of you as I see his game has improved under Tocchet. Geez, give the guy a break. He has had to deal with Melrose and his shoulder. At game 35, I made a note to myself that if he averaged a point per game from then on, he would end up with 77 points. I think he had 30 points at game 35. Currently he has 34 pts in 39 games. If he averages again 1 pt per game for the remaining 43, do the math - 77 points. With 1.5 pts per game he would end up with 98 points. I expect that he would end up somewhere in between those two numbers. Not too shabby! Oren would be stupid to trade him considering V4 still is only 28. Go ahead and dream, fellas. Your dream would turn into a nightmare for us all when V4 goes to MTL and earns over 100 pts next year when he is healthy. Not happening!!!

[hockeytalkie]

big problem i see with these guys who many of us see as "competing" most nights is this...

have all of you forgotten how much MORE INTENSE hockey in april and may are? "competing" in reg season just won't cut it. who do we have that has actually played in may? VL4, MSL, Malone, Recchi and Mezz (i skipped roberts on purpose).

i love the bolts but this group would get swept. tack's list of keepers aint bad, but our D needs lots of help and time to learn. two and half men on D (thanks flasher) will not do and simply would not last a series. if what you're saying they could grow into something... sure, i'll drink some of that koolaid. but IMHO we're looking at 2 years from now AT BEST just to get in to the show. that's the 2010-11 season!

[Max Hunter]

Speaking of Goalies....

What's up with Godzilla? Is he through for the season? Seriously, we haven't heard "pip" from him. When's he coming back? His career isn't over yet, is it?

Max

[leo]

Like Mike just alluded to, Steve,
Give Mr. Gainey a call.
See if he's "untradeable".
Steve.
C'mon.
P.

[Mike13]

Ajax,

I still think Holmqvist would be a very good backup goalie in the NHL. He was amazing on shootouts because he could focus on 1 guy on a breakaway and not worry about rebounds. His biggest problem was giving up one-timers or wristers that came at him on the short side.

Denis couldn't control a rebound to save his career.

Neither of their weaknesses are easily exploited during a shootout.

On the 1 goal loss issue, the difference between championship teams and the rest of the league is their killer instinct and refusal to lose those types of games. They find a way to win. But, I think your point is that we are at least in those types of games, and not getting blown away. If we could find that killer instinct and win some of those, we'd be in the playoff race.

[Steve R]

Mike,

Jagr didn't meet the conditions (points wise) for that contract to be extended. Caps were off the hook Europe or not.

Didn't know that the new CBA wouldn't allow that.

[Steve R]

leo,

A guy who has averaged under a point a game for his career, with questionable health, 7.7M a year, and under contract until he's 45? Yea, I'd call him untradable.

[Mike13]

Easy there Leo. Vinny isn't going anywhere. The only time he will be seen in Montreal will be when he's showing your boys how to deke and shoot betweeen the legs. And just maybe for the bogus ASG.

[Mike13]

Steve R, that kind of deal was outlawed in the new CBA. Are the Caps off the hook now that Jagr is playing in Europe? I'm pretty sure they are.

[leo]

What???
Steve. C'mon.
All Vinny has to do is say "yes" and then, he's VERY tradable.
C'mon.
...eat part of the contract...
Vincent Lecavalier!
Steve!
P.

[Steve R]

Vinny is untradable with his contract unless the Bolts eat a portion of the $ ala the Caps trading Jagr to the Rangers.

[Tackleberry]

Justine,
Understand that he is the face of TB. He will likely not be traded because of the economy and his high price tag. BUT, imagine what you could get in trade for him? Top blue liner(s) AND draft pick(s). Point-wise, he is not doing well. He is only on pace for about 70pts.

If there is a way to keep V4 'AND' TB to be playoff contenders, I am all for it. I think there is a 98% chance that ownership will keep him.

Think hypothetically, think of what could jumpstart this team?