Poker fodder

SAME OL DOLLY: Remember back when we had Jennifer Harman on the show? No? Here's the link. We asked her about Doyle Brunson and how in his first Super System he says he doesn't think women should be at the poker table. But then now he asks Harman to write his updated Limit Hold Em chapter in Super System 2. She said basically that she likes to think that times have changed and that Doyle has much more respect for the female player these days. I got all warm and fuzzy when I heard that. But then I watched the WSOP last night, and saw Brunson's daughter on there. She asked Doyle to back her in the main event and he turned his own daughter down because he said "It was a crapshoot." (Is Doyle hanging around Paboo?) Can you believe this? This is a man who (as my wife said) will bet $50K on the color of his snot when he blows his nose, but he won't give his daughter $10K for the main event? I was absolutely thrilled when she outlasted EVERY Brunson on the planet in that tournament and even won a last-longer bet with Todd. We'll have to ask him about that when he finally gets on our show someday (soon hopefully). But for Doyle to bet hundreds of thousands of dollars on Todd and his friends and even golf, and deprive his daughter a $10K buy-in was plain sad.

RESPONSIBLE GAMING: Remember my plan to set my limits on FTP to something manageable? Well, Full Tilt's function doesn't work like that. It basically is a way for you to say "DON'T LET ME PLAY FOR XX HOURS!" but it can't limit how much you can lose. I think PokerRoom has that option, but FTP doesn't. So much for that plan.

BACK IN THE SADDLE: I played extremely low-limits last night and quit when I doubled my buy-in. I played just about every game, but had my most success in Razz and Pot Limit Omaha Hi. I'm just going to have to grind it out online and try my different tactics on there at the low limits and then try it out in the home game and live at the local card rooms.

BIG ANNOUNCEMENT: We'll have a big announcement soon, maybe as early as tomorrow, but defintely by next week. Not sure if you are going to like it. Stay tuned.

-- Chris

Comments

[Rob]

2:1 says its commercials/sponsorship.

[FrodoNL]

That's what I thought too. And if it is, I have no problem with that, whatsoever!

[Rob]

Exactly. If its that versus closing up shop, who would rather have the latter?

[Norman Chadd]

Chris signed on as Full Tilt Pro and will be making dorkey commercials with The Mouth

[Michael Paul]

I played Omaha Hi/Lo on Stars last night for the first time ever. As in, I've never even played for play money! I played the .01/.02 tables and managed to win almost a buck! Woot! To be honest, I was a total donk and didn't really know what hands to start with so I just played really tight. I got lucky on one pot where there was no low so I scooped. Other than that, I'm bad but learning!

Michael

[Scotsman420]

Is it another podcast about pot odds

[SkysFall]

Maybe he doesn't want to sponsor his daughter in playing poker because he'd rather she didn't...It may be a double standard, but Doyle could want his daughter to stay his innocent little girl (as much as he can) and doesn't mind gambling with his son.

...Who knows.

[Mike Brown]

Chris and AJ commentating on High Stakes Poker.

Live.

Chris: I´m rooting for a sponsorship deal.

Michael: I´ve been playing PL Omaha/8 $0.01/0.02 yesterday and made $1.50 in about half an hour. In the process I got 4 FPP´s. 4 FPP´s at a penny table..... The average pot was $4, that´s 100 big bets, average. I saw several pots of double that size. And that´s pot limit, where you can´t just put in all your money, you have to build the pot. The sweetest part was that almost always you could limp in for the flop, decide if you hit enough and if you had the nuts, you could bet, raise and got called or re-raised by second nut drawers. Sweet.
In less than two weeks and not extremely much playing $13.62 (that €10) has become $21.84.
I´ll be doing a lot of PL Omaha/8 (including trying to sattelite into WCOOP 16) because I want that October banana.

[longclaw]

Sponsors are fine, someone has to pay the rake don't they?

[Joe - Unimpressed]

Doyle: Remember, he didn't get Todd started as a player. Todd did it on his own. Maybe to not show favoritism, he's making her make it on his own (I haven't watched it yet... gotta love Pokertube!)

Low Limits: I hate playing them. I'm busted on FTP and have to wait for my monthly affliate deposit, which is only about $15.00. I play the $1 & $2 SnG's, hate it and usually play a $5 sng or two. Then if I do play a ring game, it's .05/.10 NLHE and after a few minutes I go on "I-hate-micro-limits Tilt." I stop caring and push all in with A4 when I get down to 2 or 3 bucks.

[Paboo]

Different type of crapshoot, but yes... Main Event is crapshoot b/c of the sheer number of players to mow through. :)

Happy to know his daughter lasted longer.

Paboo

[Aquaman]

About time you guys got a sponsor. I'm guessing that that is the news. You guys put out a quality show there should be some money in it.

[Chris Cosenza]

The Brunson daughter thing is perplexing. I understand when a daughter is growing up and you don't want that for her as a father, but she's in her 30s or 40s and obviously she knows how to play poker already. It's not like she walked up to him and said "Dad, I want to learn how to play poker, and I think the best way is to stumble into the WSOP $10K Main Event." She obviously has poker chops and she obviously plays well. Crapshoot or not, he bets on everything, why not his kid? She already plays so it's not like he would be tainting her.

[Nikademus]

I don't think Doyle's decision not to back his daughter is that big of deal. The Main Event *IS* a crapshoot. I'm sure he would back her in any event he felt she had a legitimate shot.

I'm surprised more pros don't decide to skip the Main Event. I wonder how many consider it simply a yearly $10k expense and attend simply because they feel they have to "because it's the main event."

[Chris Cosenza]

Sorry Nik, gotta disagree, respectfully. Regardless of a crapshoot, this goes beyong positive EV. It's his DAUGHTER and he could EASILY afford it. This man bets on EVERYTHING. And you could see the hurt in her eyes as she explained it to a national audience. It doesn't matter that the main event is a crapshoot, what matters is his daughter wanted to play and is good enough to play and he didn't back her.

[Michael Paul]

you live by the low limit sword, you die by the low limit sword.

flopped the nut straight in Hi/Lo last night but got rivered by somebody who thought his two pair was good for the Hi despite me raising pot the whole way!

As far as the Doyle thing goes, not sure if it's actually him being sexist but it is "odd" that he wouldn't back her since 10k is pretty paltry for him. It may be a crapshoot, but these guys bet thousands on which elevator will open first or which pigeon will take of flying first! they're pretty willing to throw money away on stupid prop bets all the time so paying her way into the main event seems strange.

Michael

[Michael Paul]

sorry, two pair wouldn't have been good unless he rivered a full house!

Michael

[Blazman]

Professional poker is full of degenerate losers, maybe he is trying to keep her out of that scene. You make it seem like he is a cold hearted sexist old timer. Maybe he is but you have no idea about Doyle's relationship with his daughter. Whatever his reasons they are his reasons and he is perfectly entitled to NOT bankroll whomever he doesn't want to bankroll. I think that you are drawing some conclusions and passing judgement with little information. Unless you have "Sources" that you are not disclosing. But I guess it is your right to do so.

-Blazman

[Godard]

The main event is a crapshoot, but it's also the most positive EV event in the world, what with all the donkeys. Wouldn't you want as many horses in the event as possible to increase your chances of being the Allen Cunningham or the Mike Matusow or the Scotty Nguyen who makes the final table?

[Chris Cosenza]

Blazman, did you watch the ESPN coverage? Sources? The horse's mouth is a pretty good source. She said her father wouldn't back her because it was a crapshoot. Nothing sourced about that. And do I think it's sad that a daughter can't get $10K from her multi-million dollar father who bets on whether the busboy will pick up the plate or the water glass first? Yep. But you are right, he is entitled to back whoever he wants, but I just felt terrible for her, and her brother ended up backing her. Maybe now she can get some respect.

[Gary]

Myself I think Chris got Fasso mad at him and Fasso has vowed never to return to the show.

[ChicagoJason]

By "the horse's mouth", do you mean you heard from Doyle? I didn't.

At this point I can't recall if it was his daughter who said it, or Lon McEachern's repetition of her repetition of his statement.

I don't know what his daughter's motivation would be to say something like that on international broadcast TV. Do you? I don't know what Doyle's rationale was for allegedly giving that explanation either. Do you?

How many people DID Dolly back in the ME? How many were female? Has he ever backed a female? Male? Did he back his son? (His son didn't need it? Why?) What is Doyle's(arguably the best poker player alive) return on investment for the ME over the years? Why didn't she buy herself directly in? Satellite in? What has he given her money for in the past year? How often does she ask him for money? How about for foolish investments (not saying this is)? What other issues may she (or the two of them) had historically? What has she blown money on in the past? Is she wealthy? Broke? Does he support her? Does he support a dead-beat husband of hers?

How often do you ask your parents for money for an "investment"? If I asked my father for money to help buy a house, would he contribute? How about if I was his daughter? If I couldn't afford to buy a house, but asked my father for money to play poker, would he give it?

There's a difference between backing someone to mitigate your own risk and giving your (adult) child money for playing a game of skill and chance - especially if that child doesn't have the skill or experience required (I don't know if she does or doesn't - and I don't think that has anything to do with her gender).

We don't know their situation or relationship. We don't know her situation, history, psychological profile, or poker skill level. We don't know that the statements were accurate. We don't know how Dolly has reacted in similar situations historically, or if he has backed other women. We don't know a lot of things, and we certainly cannot come to a clean judgment in this particular situation.

[Chris Cosenza]

Jason, these are all interesting, valid points. Actually it was Norman Chad who kept reiterating over and over that Doyle didn't back her. Has Doyle backed Todd? Absolutely. Do I know this as fact? Absolutely. Has he backed other women? Absolutely. Do I know that as fact? Absolutely. Remember my Cyndy Violette interview? He paid for her to play in EVERY event last year. What I meant from the horse's mouth was his daughter said it. That's good enough for me, this wasn't a news broadcast, it was an interview. Clearly she wasn't lying about it, and Todd ended up sponsoring her and she mentioned that too, so that tells me she asked her dad and he said "it's a crapshoot."

And you can't hold up our financial situations against his when you're making your analogies. $10K to him is like $10 to me. Would I give my daughter $10? Absolutely.

I guess the way my post was written pointed to Doyle still not giving respect to women, and for that I feel now the insinuation was a tad strong. But if your daughter wants $10K and it wouldn't make one bit of difference to your financial solvency, wouldn't you do it?

[ChicagoJason]

If I'd given my daughter $10K (or $10.00) regularly and she blew on something like tootsie rolls, scratch-and-sniff stickers, cigarettes, heroin, or gambling problems (obviously _I_ wouldn't contend, nor Doyle, that poker is a gambling issue for some - like him - but maybe it _is_ the way she plays it and other games). I would give my daughter my last $10 if it was for food or shelter, etc. (Incidentally, this is all hypothetical, I don't have children).

I think that the fact that she backed Cyndy Violette in every event last year is evidence enough for me to contend that it isn't a sexist decision, but rather based in something else (familial, historical, etc.)

Good debate, Chris. Thanks for taking the time to respond to my arguments.

[Chris Cosenza]

Jason,

This is fun, and I always appreciate a good debate on here. Thanks for playing along.

Yeah, I don't really think Doyle is sexist toward his daughter. But you sort of fell into your own trap here, kinda like slowplaying AA as your opponent makes a flush on the river. You talked about my assumptions and then gave this laundry list of possible reasons Doyle didn't give her the money, saying I couldn't possibly know the reason for not backing her. Yet your last comment says his reason for not backing her probably was familial, historical, etc. Now, aren't you making assumptions? Aren't you as guilty as I am now? 8-)

Couldn't it be something as simple as he really thinks it's a crapshoot and doesn't respect her ability? Maybe it is that he's sexist. But again, giving her $10K to enter a tournament is not the equivalent of her blowing it on blow, etc. Plus, if the reason were truly for something unsavory, do you really think she would agree to be interviewed for a lengthy segment by ESPN for the whole world to see and disect? If she were lying, or if she had skeletons, I doubt she'd do anything publicly, and certainly she wouldn't call out her dad on national TV, opening herself up to criticism and investigation.

Plus, given that Doyle's been a gambler his whole life and he bets on some of the most ludicrous things, a drop in the bucket should not be denied to his very capable daughter, especially when his son is given the same consideration. Plus, that $10K was an investment, not a loan or handout. They would have had the same arrangement as any other backer-player relationship. Just seems like the signal he sent his daughter (and now the world) was pretty harsh. I mean, let's face it, because of his rejection, people are spouting theories on web sites that have her married to a deadbeat, addicted to heroin and burning her parents out of millions. 8-)