Here's The June 26 Chat: Read A Transcript

One reader in today's live chat here on TroxBlog argued it's a waste of money to get rid of touch-screen voting machines. Another thought we ought to tax churches.

One wanted to know more about Pinellas County's deal with a guy who manages -- and hunts -- publicly owned land in Pasco County.

Others asked about former state House candidate Angelo Cappelli, why Florida schools don't get enough money, and even about the health of my dog Harry. Being part of the superficial media, I tried to trivialize things with talk of Paris Hilton and the Devil Rays bullpen, but the readers kept things honest.

To read a transcript of today's live chat, just click on the "Comments" link a few lines below. You can still add your own comments at the bottom. To see what folks had to say in previous weeks, click on "Chat Transcripts" over in the left-hand column.

Thanks to everyone who came by or took part today!

Comments

[Howard Troxler]

Let's start with a pre-filed comment by Lucia:

What a grand time for Charlie Crist to sign his boneheaded "paper trail" bill! Poor people trying to enjoy nature will pay more at Fort De Soto, others will lose their jobs, but we're spending millions locally and at the state level to take us back to the past to vote on paper! And what about that dopey Pinellas airport spending millions to refurbish a place no one uses! I hope County Administrator Spratt can justify that one while he lays off a guy who cleans the restrooms at a park!

[Howard Troxler]

Lucia, I have to say, I thought most folks were in favor of going back to a voting system that has a physical record of the vote -- in this case, optical-scan cards. But I'm not arguing your greater point that there might be other things best not bought -- see my column in today's newspaper.

[Howard Troxler]

Tom pre-filed these questions:

Last week 20/20 posted an article involving a private hunting lodge located on Pinellas County taxpayer owned land, and it read like a bombshell going off. It involved Pick Talley and others. Has anyone at the Times looked into this? If not, why not???

Also, the week before you indicated that you would have a look into the infamous desal plant boondoggle. Have you turned up anything on that?

[Teacher]

The Superintendent has spoken in regard to the tax reform and how it might impact educational funding in Pinellas County. “Pinellas schools could lose up to $70-million a year, Superintendent, Clayton Wilcox, told board members today,” according to an article last week.

He also mentions, “Yes, $70-million is a sky-is-falling number, the superintendent conceded. It assumes legislators won't make good on promises to adequately fund education by making up the deficit with other kinds of revenue (Many local officials doubt they can).”

Then we heard from Wayne Blanton, “"Wayne Blanton, executive director of the Florida School Boards Association, is comforted by the fact that school funding is protected under the state Constitution."

This is a joke Howard! Florida’s mention in the Constitution of “adequate” funding for public schools is as much a smoke screen and political tool as was the acceptance of the Florida Lottery when we believed the proceeds would add to educational funding. In reality it only replaced other funding from the State. It was as much a lie as the promise to “adequately” fund Florida schools according to our State Constitution. Therefore it is apparent to educators across the state that Florida does not value our children or our future.

We have NO formula to determine “adequate” funding for Florida schools. Check it out Howard, you’ll find other states around us do have “adequate” funding formulas. It’s not just a word put in a Constitution only to sit there without ever being examined for its effectiveness. If we’re so far below the national average of per pupil spending (approx. $ 3,500.00 per student) would this indicate “adequate” funding?

There has been research on this topic, but until the people demand attention to the matter, nothing will change. Other states allocate more funds per student and have a specific formula to use that is routinely reexamined and adjustments made to ensure their schools are “adequately” funded. In Florida we can’t make such a comparison to other states because we don’t even have a formula to compare to. How serious can the commitment to fund education in our state really be? How can Wayne Blanton be comforted by the state Constitution in light of the tax reform proposal?

We need much discussion on this, Howard, and I’m glad it’s coming. We cannot count on the State to protect educational funding when they have a history of doing business like this. Educators in Florida do not trust our State to protect anything when it comes to our children; they created their own distrust amongst the people.

[Pablo]

Angelo Cappelli update?

[Howard Troxler]

Tom, here's what I know. The county pays a guy up there to manage that 12,000-acre property, and part of the deal is to "manage" the population of wild hogs.

The guy is resident on the property and can bring people in to help. As far as there being a "hunting lodge" I don't have any first-hand knowledge of it, the key word there being "first-hand."

The whole thing sounds a little suspect to me, however, and it seems just as well that the county proposes to sell the property.

[Howard Troxler]

Teacher, the "adequate" language in the Constitution seems to me, unfortunately, to be only so much window-dressing, since the courts have declined to define what it means.

[Howard Troxler]

And Tom, you have caught me red-handed on failing to follow up on the status of the desal plant. Red-faced, too. I just wrote "DESAL PLANT" atop my to-do list and will post something on the blog soonest.

[Howard Troxler]

Re: Cappelli: There was a story in the paper three days ago revealing that he was under investigation by his former employer, SunTrust bank. Here is the link:

http://pqasb.pqarchiver.com/sptimes/access/1293571361.html?dids=1293571361:1293571361&FMT=FT&FMTS=ABS:FT&date=Jun+23%2C+2007&author=CARRIE+WEIMAR&pub=St.+Petersburg+Times&edition=&startpage=3.B&desc=BANK+INVESTIGATING+FORMER+CANDIDATE

Man, that is some link! Sorry.

Now, are you saying we should already have run an update from the story three days ago? I don't know if anything else has happened but will message our reporter to check while we're online here.

[Tom]

Manage sure is an interesting word, in that context. Manage implies keep 'em around for what reason? And is it true that the guy on the property makes over $300,000 per year for his management services and gets to live on the property as part of his sweetheart deal?

Methinks you ought to be getting some of that first hand knowledge, Howard, before it gets trucked off the property.

[Howard Troxler]

I just checked with Carrie Weimar, the reporter who wrote the article on June 23. She does not know of anything new so far....

[Howard Troxler]

Tom, I believe you have the facts correct on the approximate size of the contract. "Manage" means hunt and kill, of course. Also there are allegations there's deer hunting going on there.

I will tell you that we have been there, staked it out, tried to see who was coming and going and got shooed off.

I would think since it was pubilc land the county would be happy to show it. Maybe I will ask for a tour. To be blunt with you, I've been kinda occupied lately with state-level stuff, the Legislature, property taxes, Brooker Creek and other things, and although this looks like a funny deal, it h'aint been #1 on my list...

[Teacher]

In 1998, voters statewide endorsed a constitutional amendment calling for the state to provide adequate funding for a "high- quality" education for all students.

Despite that mandate, Florida's per-pupil funding ranks 42nd in the nation.

[Lucia]

Howard, regarding the "paper trail"....I don't think people are really up on what they're buying. They won't get any sort of receipt, as the Governor likes to say. All it'll be is a paper ballot you mark your selection on. We've always had that in the form of absentee voting. There's no magical piece of paper. The elections people will be looking at zillions of ballots where the voter's choice isn't clear. Doesn't that remind you of the ol' hanging and pregnant chads? Welcome to the past, people!

[Howard Troxler]

Teacher, you are right, but the problem as I said earlier is that the courts have refused to define "adequate" or "quality" or any other term. To do so requires the courts to second-guess the Legislature, saying, X number of dollars is or is not enough... which is a nasty business.

A few years ago remember that some voters tried to get an amendment passed that would define it precisely -- at least 40 percent of the state's general revenue would have to go to education. The Supreme Court threw it off the ballot on technical grounds (not on the basis of whether it was a good or bad idea).

The best solution, of course, is the hardest -- to elect members of the Legislature who would give education the level of support you'd like to see.

[Pablo]

Re: Cappelli, I'm out of town and haven't mastered your newly redesigned website, so was simply asking if there was new information. Not complaining, just asking. Thanks.

[Tom]

So how is your dog faring, Howard? I recall your writing about how you "managed" to keep a clown fish alive and healthy for so many years - a remarkable accomplishment and proof of your animal husbandry skills. I know your dog adopted great owners. Hope he is comfortable and getting a good lick of ice cream.

[Howard Troxler]

Lucia, thanks for the follow-up. If you Google my name you will see on the first page that I was a defender of the touch-screen system against conspiracy theories. So it's a little weird for me now to be defending going "back" to optical scan.

But the chief virtue of a physical ballot is NOT whether a voter gets a "receipt." The chief virtue is that there is a physical record left of the ballot, which can be used to verify or recount the election instead of relying on a silicon chip with no other verification.

All I'm sayin' is, THAT'S why everybody has been all fired up about going "back" these past few years... if you think it's a bad idea, you are of course fully entitled to your opinion!

[Howard Troxler]

Why, Tom, thanks for askin' about Harry! Our half-Lab half-German shepherd was diagnosed with cancer in November and given 1-3 months. He coming up on 8 months later and is eagerly taking his meals, his walks, his treats, roaring at the doorbell, begging visitors for love, etc. -- he definitely is slowing down and you can see the disease weakening him over time but he still has quality of life and seems to have no pain. He is not done yet.

[Lucia]

But, Howard...people who were paranoid about electronic voting could always choose to vote paper. Now people who feel comfortable with electronic votes don't have the same choice and are now stuck with using a system that we have to pay for. I don't feel right having government cut funding for human services when they're buying new voting equipment.

[Teacher]

Howard, the thing that is so absurd is how they can expect educators (voters) to trust them with the promise to protect educational funding in light of the tax reform?

As long as the State neglects to do it's part to adequately fund Florida Schools, the local districts are dependent on tax revenue to make it up. This is how we've been doing it for years. The people need to understand it.

We can't go on a promise, that's for sure.

Thanks again, Howard, for allowing me to speak up on this issue.

[Howard Troxler]

Here are some (excerpted) pre-filed comments by 20/20:

Citizens of Pinellas already pay their entrance fee to our parks via our tax contributions to the budget. Increase and/or add fees for those coming from outside our county to enjoy what our citizens have paid to create.

The expansion of St. Pete/Clearwater International Airport is a good thing from an economic perspective. However, a hidden goal is to increase passenger traffic so that we can build the “Airport-to-Beach elevated rail for tourists. A boondoggle at best.

Not one iota or service nor one job needs to be cut due to fiscal responsibility being demanded of our government by the people. There is a tremendous amount of tax dollars spent in Pinellas on pork projects, unnecessary consultants, and multi-levels of unnecessary and high-paid management that can be trimmed.

[Howard Troxler]

Part of what Teacher is talking about, specifically, is that the proposed amendment to our state Constitution -- which would expand the existing homestead exemption --would remove almost $7.2-billion from school tax revenues in Florida over the first five years.

During the debate in the Legislature's recent special session on property taxes, the Republican leadership specifcially promised to hold school systems "harmless" for this tax cut. In other words, they would make up the difference -- somehow. Democratic critics refer to this as the "trust us" promise.

[Susan]

Does anybody remember a few years ago when the president of the Florida Senate tried to get legislation to close "loopholes" in the sales tax? Most of the "loopholes" were for services, but I think some also involved sales of goods that are not taxed because various business interests had gotten exceptions written into the law. The effort failed, mainly because the majority of Republicans opposed anything that could be construed as a "tax increase" even if it were strictly a matter of increasing fairness. Question--do you think there is any chance at all of this being revived?

[Howard Troxler]

Susan, thank you for the great question!

This has been a battle for the past 20+ years in Florida. Our state sales tax mostly applies to THINGS that are bought, but not SERVICES.

Every now and then somebody proposes taxing services, too. But as Susan correctly points out, the recent rhetoric in the Legislature has been to call that a "tax increase."

In other words, this protects the special-interest tax breaks given to hundreds of services -- and some goods, whose makers had the right lobbyist.

Frankly I do NOT see this Legislature being eager to tax services in the near future... I wish that big-deal tax study commission, which can proposed its own changes to the Constitution, would consider it.

NOT NOT NOT to RAISE taxes -- but to make them more fair. Heck, if they taxed everybody fairly and made it revenue neutral, taxes could come DOWN on everybody else.

[Tom]

Lucia,
An honest and accurate and recountable vote is the cornerstone to our liberties. Without such a system, those with the power (absolute power) could be tempted to do nefarious things. This is a good expenditure as it keeps the cornerstone of all our liberties and rights secure from not just impropriety but the appearance of impropriety which can trigger a lack of faith in our entire system of self government.

[Howard Troxler]

I know that everyone here is high-minded and thoughtful about important issues, but I cannot help asking whether anybody else agrees with me that Casey Fossum has lost his way and ought not be on the 25-man roster of the Tampa Bay Devil Rays...

Also, what would you think of a column urging folks NOT to watch Paris Hilton's interview on Larry King Wed nite as a protest of natl' media? Or would it be stupid because it would call attention to the very thing I was saying we shouldn't pay attention to?

I usually just ignore stuff like that...

[Tom]

On the Paris Hilton interview question. Howard, I believe that PBS is airing a tribute to Paul Simon - the Gershwin Awards Presentation, if memory serves. Now, who in their right mind would want to watch the King/Paris atonement, knowing that Paul Simon, who will be doing a song or two with his pal, Artie Garfunkle, will be just a click away? Nobody I hang with, that's for sure.

[Jennifer W]

How about we have a big party for Harry Wednesday night instead?

[Howard Troxler]

Hmm, Tom, I do not know if the sentiment will be universal. Meanwhile I am struck by the juxtaposition of 60ish '60s singers vs. the very definition of '00s nothingness...

[Tom]

Casey who?

[Howard Troxler]

Actually this Wednesday is bachelor night at our house since my wife is catching a show in Tampa. Harry & I are probably going to wolf down pizza, run around the house playing air guitar & fetch, and then I'm gonna let him jump up on the bed and roll around shamelessly. fun.

[Howard Troxler]

Hey, it's 1 o'clock! If anybody wants to add anything...

[Schauer]

I suppose that is we really wanted to increase the tax base we could start taxing church properties. That is some prime real estate off the tax rolls and they do so little good for the community.

[Susan]

Regarding the Paris Hilton interview--I would not have known about this if you hadn't mentioned it, so there's your answer on the "calling attention" issue; on the other hand, I don't plan to watch it anyway, and am mystified as to why anyone would (unless she was naked, in which case I would understand why guys would watch, but I'm quite sure that's not the case).

[Howard Troxler]

Not on Larry King Live, anyway, Susan...

Schauer, I'll wait for you to start the "tax the churches" petition drive.

THANK YOU to everybody who stopped by or added to this week's live chat. I'll leave comments open for anyone who would like to add something.

Have a great week, and I hope to see you again next Tuesday!

Best,
Howard

[Tom]

Paul Simon is not so much a singer as a song writer. And while he got started in the 60's and is, yikes, 65 years young, his achievements in songs have spanned the decades. And you are correct about Ms. Hilton being symbolic of this current age of emptiness.

[Larry]

Howard, no Paris Hilton. You're way above all that.