Red light cameras, drug privacy, baseball, good citizenship

See my colleague Mike Brassfield's story this morning about red-light cameras, which are coming to a few cities in the Tampa Bay area. Hillsborough County will consider such a program on Thursday. And this spring the Legislature will consider a law that allows their use everywhere. Ironically, the sponsor of this major expansion of government power is named Ron Reagan.

I have a deep-seated distrust of any law enforcement measure that (1) relies on a private company for enforcement and (2) creates a profit motive for both that company, and the government itself. I think any contract with a private company should NOT be based on per-ticket revenue, and that the government should not get the revenues from this program. That should suit the government just fine, since everybody is saying this is "not about the money," but about public safety.

Elsewhere on this beautiful Monday morning:

* I was surprised to see my friends over on the editorial page so easily accept the idea of computer databases of drug prescriptions this morning, in the name of cracking down on abuse. Once again, the argument is that because SOME people break the law, all OTHER people who live legally must submit to  government intrusion. The heck with that. Stay out of my medicine cabinet.

* This seemed like a pretty fair column by St. Petersburg Mayor Rick Baker. His basic point is, for him it's too early to decide the merits or demerits of a downtown waterfront baseball stadium. As he notes,  some folks are already against it no matter what, and some say they're for it no matter what. I can understand why some folks can be against it no matter what. But the second position seems odd to me, since I don't think anybody can possibly be unquestionably for it until we see some numbers. Note, by the way, Baker's indirect reference toward the end toward more recognition for St. Petersburg! Told ya he wants a name change for the baseball team...

*  Cheers to former governor and U.S. senator Bob Graham and best wishes to the new Bob Graham Center for Public Service at the University of Florida. One of the ideas is that Americans are largely ignorant of what it means to be a U.S. citizen, why our nation was created in the first place, and our rights and our responsibilities that go with that citizenship. Here's Graham's column from this morning's paper.

Comments

[John Gibson]

so who does get the red light money? It can't go to the company, it can't go to the government. Remember, schools, etc. are government agencies. This leaves the money going somewhere in the private sector. But where?

My opinion is to let the money go to the government. First to pay for the system, the rest to general law enforcement.

Don't buy it. It is more "we're from the govt. and we're here to help you."

It is illegal search of movements of ordinary citizens designed to have chilling effect our right to assemble for protest, for redress of grievances.

Stop the Telcom spying without warrants too. No one is endangered by INSISTING on FISA warrants to authorize spying on our free speech. We all lose when govt. puts itself ABOVE the law -- and even wants immunity to do it in the future.

[David Mathews]

Oil is $103 a barrel, gasoline spot is $2.72 and retail gasoline is going to establish a new all-time record high price in a few days, diesel prices are approaching $4 a gallon, silver is above $20 an ounce, gold is almost $1000 an ounce, and the US Dollar is quickly transforming into worthless paper.

The St. Petersburg Times really does need to warn the public that the world that they grew up in and feel entitled to is coming to a swift and total end. The end of the automotive age, the end of consumerism, the end of cheap food, and the end of the American empire ... these are all going to end within our lifetime and soon.

The newspaper isn't doing the public any favors by encouraging oil addiction and shopping addiction by advertising. If the public maintains an entitlement mentality our civilization will collapse in a horrible manner.

The newspaper must prepare the public for the changes which are coming. The newspaper also ought to begin questioning how the residents of the Florida coastline will evacuate in the event of a hurricane in the post-automobile era.

A lack of planning today leads to a horrendous catastrophe tomorrow.

[guy]

Tell Rick Baker to get bent.
THe city of St. Pete should keep Al Lang Field.
It is part of our history and a unique entity in itself.
Babe Ruth, Gehrig and so many great
ballplayers spent a lot of time here and it does justice to our downtown.
The Ray's are advertizing on the radio like it is a done deal.
Tearing down the present stadium does not make a bit of sense.
Our "MAYOR" should tell them to go back to the dugout and play baseball.

[Alex]

It was my understanding that the gov't is simply outsourcing the camera production and maintenance to a private company. Law enforcement is still the gatekeeper, ie, a law enforcement officer views the tape and he/she decides if it's worth a ticket or not. If not, no money for the company, no ticket to the offender.

Gov't today outsources all kinds of things from the private sector. The Sunpass tags are privately produced and maintained. Police cars are built by Ford. Isn't the camera thing a similar arrangement?

[20/20]

Law enforcement motivated by profit is not law enforcement at all. To assert that standard “for profit” principles will not apply here is naive. The public would be better served in having these cameras installed on the property of registered sex offenders. One of the core ideologies in creating a police force is to deter by way of presence. If one sees law enforcement, one is less likely to break the law.

This is a prime example of the misleading motives of our politicians’ proclamation to “improve our quality of life”. We start out by selling you a “traffic control” technology designed to improve our traffic congestion, and quickly turn it into a profit-driven way to eliminate the workforce.

Regardless of its deficiencies, control over certain aspects of our daily lives such as water, sewer, trash removal, education, food inspection, military, homeland security, law enforcement and the like… must remain in the hands of “not-for-profit” Government.

[Alex]

20/20, I would contend that some of the things on your list (education, food inspection, etc) have been screwed-up by government long ago.

[Brian]

11:43 20/20 isn't interested in the facts, only his next County Commission campaign.

[Curt]

If I loan my car to my cousin and she blows a red light does that mean I get a ticket? A private company is going to maintain and operate these cameras? We need to be clear on this if this is the case. Where is the money going for fines paid on this violation? It is very obvious we need more traffic law enforcement, but how can this be legaly done without true law enforcement officials (true police). Cameras at intersections are no way of going about this fairly. This is not a substitute for real traffic cops. I would be willing to bet over time the courts will throw this out anyway? Sounds like yet another way to filter tax payers money to private industry with loud lobbyists.

[727guy]

The problem is not one of privacy, no one expects right to privacy in a public place. The issue is that a private firm installs these things, and they don't make a dime unless people break the law.

If these things really solve the issue of red light runners, then their stated business model would cause them to progressively lose revenue over time, eventually making no money at all. Does anyone actually expect them to allow that once the system is installed?

Almost everywhere that this scam has been perpetrated, the grace period for yellows has been lowered, which flies in the face of studies that show that longer yellows reduce accidents. But they increase revenues, so lower they go! Can't disappoint our good 'partners' in the red-light camera biz!

And those that say as long as you don't run red lights, you have nothing to fear, should ask themselves if they want to take an entire day off to go fight one if their car is misidentified, which happens frequently. Innocent until proven guilty is not at play here. You're guilty until you take the time to prove otherwise. Yes, you can fight it, but you're going to have to go down to the DMV and slug it out with some grumbly civil servant to do so. They know most people are too busy or too lazy to fight it, so they'll just pay.

The bottom line is, its only a bad idea if a private industry gets the funds. If the state thinks its such a great idea, then they should pay for the infrastructure themselves and proceeds would go to pay for the system. Otherwise it will always be about the money, never about safety, and will not serve the citizens of this state.

[jul]

What happens whey anyone violates the law and they are found to be guilty? They pay some sort of money. . . Running a red light is not different, even if a camera catches you, which for all tense and purposes, is better evidence than a human. . .

Ok, jul... then I guess you'd have no objection to installing one in your home so we can make sure you don't violate the law in private either... I mean, why should we rely on a human living in your home to be a witness?

... it's all about the law, right?

[Jim Johnson]

It's 1984. Big Brother can observe you and mail you the ticket. And there will be quotas; these guys arent doing it to be good citizens.

And it wont end with traffic signals. Once the money starts rolling in cameras will be everywhere.

[20/20]

Alex, you have a point. But I would contend that it isn’t “government control” that is the problem, rather those in “control of our government”. It never fails to amaze me how willing our leaders are to admit their own incompetence, yet most people miss it.

From my perspective, when a political leader (and I use that term loosely) proclaims that we are better off outsourcing a “not-for-profit” function of our government to a “for-profit” entity – in affect – they are admitting to their own inability to achieve effective and efficient government operation, for which they are responsible. This is not the fault of the government itself, rather those we vote in to government.

The answer isn’t “outsourcing” our government; the answer is voting out its ineffective leadership.

[Jim Johnson]

Well, the video is evidence, and the company that records the violation isnt certified law enforcement, which creates a chain of custody problem.

If I follow Howard around with a cam-corder and catch him spitting on the sidewalk or walking on the grass at the library, I have doubts the police will accept my video as evidence.

I say we just outsource our entire law enforcement to OCP and their squad of RoboCops. Then we can bring Tom Cruz into the picture with that whole Minority Report set up and bust people when they “think” about committing a crime. If we finish the deal by surrounding Manhattan with an 80’ wall, turning the whole island into a prison, we can hire Snake Pliskin as the warden.

… DAMN!… I just saw Cruz walk by… I bet they found out I thought about knocking over that boiled peanuts stand in Lutz!

… I gotta go.

[727guy]

@Jul - The camera might be 'better evidence' if its installed correctly and calibrated correctly, but prior history tells us that isn't always the case. In Washington D.C., where they have had red light and speed-limit cameras since 2002, they throw out just less than half of the violations that are recorded, and thats only if the citizen chooses to contest it. In many cases its not even their vehicle in the picture.

That doesnt stop them from counting the total number of infractions (without subtracting the incorrect ones) as 'proof' that their system is 'working'.

Oh, and not to mention, in D.C. at least, if you request to see the maintenance records of the camera that snapped your fine, that request will be denied.

Or how about in Mesa, Arizona, where people were apparently so law-abiding that the contractor (lockheed-martin, in this case) wasn't making their minimum break-even point. The solution? Rejigger all the laws so that they could! First, they raised the cost of the infraction. When that didn't work, they retooled the infraction itself, making it an 'effective' run if you stop within the two white crosswalk lines. When all else failed, they lowered the time of the yellow light so that more people could be ticketed.

Make no mistake. This is a revenue-generating SCAM, and any Floridian with a shred of concern for civil liberty should be steadfastly against it.

[727guy]

Just for the record, other excellent examples of private industry 'filling in the gaps' of local government include:

Enron
Blackwater
Halliburton

'Nuff said.

[George Goodenough]

Lets not confuse the anonymity to which we have become accustomed in our urban environment with a mythical right to privacy in public places. Time was we all lived in small communities and our behavior outside the home and a lot of it inside the home was subject to public approval or disapproval. It was only when we became anonymous that we began to think we could get away with something. There never has been a right to privacy in public.

[Richard]

Buy all the stock you can in the Donut shop industry. With these cameras the Police will have more time to hang out there.

[ENough]

Big Brother is watching you. What happened to the 60's when American citizens protested the abuse of power by the police? Back then they were called "pigs," but now they have positioned themselves as gods, thanks to TV shows like COPS and a great PR campaign. The so-called "war on crime, drugs, terroists, whatever," has tranformed "the war on poverty" to a "war on the poor." Moreover, citizens have become consumers and our only right is to BUY STUFF. With gas prices skyrocketing, who can afford to go to a mall, let alone go on a shopping spree? Like Rome we have our colliseums to bemuse the masses, while our leaders bleed us. And God has blessed America...

Just wait, they will be checking the time stamps on your speedpass on toll-roads. Then mailing the speedpass holder for driving too fast!

Don't they already do that on the Jersey turnpike? You know the one, it passes through Moscow and Leningrad...