Florida's 'tax reform' commission

Happy Monday to everybody. Hey, I got burglarized over the weekend; what did YOU do for fun? Sheesh. Around midnight Friday I'm sitting on my back screened-in patio working on my laptop, when a guy rings the front doorbell claiming to be asking for directions. In the few seconds it takes me to get rid of the guy at the front door, his accomplice barges into my patio, snatches my computer and runs. Looks like a mini-gang working the neighborhood, since there were a couple other break-ins and a little vandalism too. The little $#$%s.

Anyway, my print column for tomorrow will be about the final work product of the Taxation and Budget Reform Commission, which meets every 20 years to "reform" Florida's tax structure. I gotta tell you, this edition of the commission ended up being fairly puny and small-bore. We will be voting on seven proposals that the commission voted to put on the November ballot.

The one big structural tax change the commission proposes is a "tax swap" in which we would get rid of most of our school property taxes. To replace the money, the Legislature could raise the state sales tax and close existing tax loopholes. But this amendment doesn't say HOW to fill the gap and I think it has a lot of problems.

The other proposals range from rinky-dink to political axe-grinding. There's a special-interest tax break proposed for "working waterfront property." Large landholders could get a tax break for declaring their property to be conservation land. One idea would allow a local-option sales tax to support community colleges and another would grant a tax break to homeowners for hurricane improvements.

The most controversial two ideas would reverse Florida's long-standing separation between using tax dollars in support of religious institutions. One ballot measure repeals Florida's existing overall ban, and a second makes it clear that tax dollars can be used for school vouchers to give money to private schools, including religious schools.

This is small-time political axe-grinding, tax-break-seeking stuff. It was not the idea behind creating this 25-member commission every two decades to take a deep-thinking look at Florida's tax structure. As I've written before, this body, appointed by the House speaker, Senate president and governor, is acting more like a "second Legislature," with all its petty failures.

Comments

[Rich]

2nd Legislature is right. They should have taken the opportunity to hire an impartial panel of economic tax experts. Throw 50 academics in a hat and draw 25 and let them come up with true tax reform. These are more of the same with special interest groups heavily represented.

St Joe's must love the conservation land tax breaks. Largest holder of land in Florida can now avoid paying taxes until the property market comes back.

Sorry to hear about the break-in.

By the way, if you live in a mandatory homeownwers association - you'll LOVE Posey's bill - that is if you're the Association.

Home court is really "Association's Court." The "aggrieved party" (typically the association) hires an attorney, chooses the mediator and ultimately, if needed, chooses the arbitrator.

So be prepared to pull out your checkbooks. If you don't roll over for the Association you have to front 1/2 the money for the Association's choice of mediator. If you don't reach settlement you have to front 1/2 the money for the Assocition's choice of arbitrator. If you don't win you will pay the entire cost of mediation, the entire cost of arbitration and the entire cost of the Association's attorney. If you decide not to participate in the mediation or arbitration and go directly to court, you forgo any chance of getting your attorney's fees if you win and you are still liable for all of the Association's fees and costs if you lose.

So much for our "consumer friendly" Legislature - Now just how many of them are attorneys?

[Larry]

Howard, for only having a shot at it once every twenty years, I'd say we blew it. True, they have rearranged some taxes, but not for the better in my opinion, and definitely added to the perception of Florida's reputation for education on the cheap. No wonder Wilcox wanted to get the hell out of here.

[Jon McPhee]

Like, who's surprised? And who cares any more? It's just going to get worse, as the cancer of special interest pleading and money grubbing and grabbing keeps on keepin' on. Will there be food riots by teachers and burger flippers outside the new, really cool Stadium? Game almost over.

[Logical Teacher]

Hyperbole. Starting teachers make ~37k a year.

Pinellas teachers rejected an (imperfect) incentive program on principle - the single dumbest thing I've ever witnessed. Hillsborough benefits because of our unwillingness to support something that was "unfair".

They're well fed - don't let them tell you otherwise.

[Don Mott]

With what they have accomplished it is probably a good thing they only meet every twenty years. A tax swap that will break our schools, oh well Ronda I guess we don't have to worry about your pseudo-science bill since there will be no money to teach it. If anyone thinks the legislature will make up the difference without it costing the taxpayer more than they save you are delusional. It's a feel good scam. School vouchers that Jeb's buddies pushed through dismantling the separation of church and state. A land conservation tax break that will benefit wealthy land owners like St. Joes and other developers, and take possibly millions of dollars off the tax rolls. Well if Buddy Johnson's green belt app is declined now he can claim his land as a conservation easement. You were spot on Howard, a "second legislature". I just hope voters are aware of all of the ramifications when they go to the polls, but I have my doubts.

Howard,

The burglary, two thoughts. NEVER answer a doorbell with the person site unseen and who is not expected at such a late hour as midnight.
Two: crime is definitely a problem in this city, has been for a long time. Our authorized strength is supposed to be 553, I believe, yet as far as I've heard we're down to 480 POLICE OFFICERS. We can't keep 'em and we can't get new officers very easily. Our fire unions are already at an impasse, and the police union is about to go there due to the raise issue.

Another reason why this city has REAL problems to solve, which most definitely include the public welfare and safety WHICH INDLUES finding the FINANCING to keep the bare minimum "wheels a' turnin".

Another reason that I feel so strongly about what I think are misplaced priorities focusing on a national pastime.........you, most unfortunately, have experienced the result of our public safety system being flawed and disfunctional........the bad guys know it, and in your case, most defintely flaunted it.

I'm so sorry, but the way things tend to go these days, be happy that you are ALIVE and whole.

Where was Louie?????

Lorraine

[guy]

I am so sorry about your being burglarized.
You were not harmed physically but the mental part you will carry forever.
This can be a good thing because it will have an effect on your future views and decisions.
Reality check ~~ Crime is alive and well here in St. Pete.
Our civic leaders are looking the other way, so it is only
going to get worse.
Nobody wants to admit that it is out of control under their watch.
You Howard can do much more than the average Joe to push for someone to start getting off their rears and give us some action.
I'm sure you don't live in a bad neighborhood so you can begin to understand what some other places are going through ~~~ PS the laptop is neat. LOL

[guy]

Schools have always been funded and always will.
A sales tax is the answer to every problem we face, both locally and federally.
You can give the low income citizens a pass card and those who are able to spend a lot will pay all.
Like a penny tax on a $100,000 dollar car would be $1000.
not a bad thing.

[guy]

The GUY is loose.

[justme]

Education is a very important thing. It just seems Florida education has always been last on the list for funding. At one point we were ranked 47th in the nation for education. If we do not educate our future leaders (OMG!! help us)and keep them in school they will come and and burglarize our home and take our laptops at midnight.
Uhmm Howard, what the heck were you thinking answering your door at midnight?
Anyways.. I still haven't decided if the sale tax would be the way to go. I will be keeping a eye on this blog as it does give me a lot of insight on some issues.
OH .. how about them Ray's sweeping the Red Socks this weekend? Is this part of the plan for getting a new stadium is to start producing a winning team?

[Kat]

Howard,
That is just awful news about the burglary. Can you describe the perpetrators that you think are a little gang operating in your neighborhood so that others can be on the lookout? Of course, I believe the number of officers the City of St. Petersburg has makes a difference in the type and amount of crime our citizens experience. I've detected that a certain mayor has been given a huge pass on the crime issue which has happened under his watch. Of course, Wingay Newton's district gets it. No matter how the mayor spins it, you cannot hide the bodies. I feel safer with my kids in NYC than I do at home in certain parts of St. Pete. Good luck with recovering your laptop. You will find well meaning but underfunded officers responding.
About the legislature's attempt at tax reform. Notta chance.Most of the current mess was as due to mishandling by local government officials who set the local millage rates. Look at all the special goodies under baker's "blanket contracts". Small wonder there is a tax crisis.

[Kathleen]

Wow! What a terrific series those Rays played against Boston, World Series defenders! Go, Carl Crawford! Go Nathan Hanes! Go Ikamura! Go Jim Shields!! Go, Tropicana Field where it all happened!!!!!

[Don Mott]

Hey guy, what color is the sky in your world? What happens to state income when spending goes into the dumper? Like what is happening now? And where will the needed school funding come from? The sales tax deal leaves a big gap in education funding that will come from somewhere and I can assure you there is no magical sales tax genie to take care of it. And it certainly won't come from special interests or tax exemptions/loopholes since those have already been voted off limits. It will come out of our pockets in other ways. By the way how many people buy those $100,000 cars which add a paltry $1,000 to the states treasury? Unless all you buy is medicine and food the sales tax will affect you and you will be affected even more when the next legislature comes looking to make up the lost revenue, you can take that to the bank.

[Howard Troxler]

Thanks for the comments so far.

On the burglary, make no mistake -- I did NOT go to the front door and just throw it open. I was entirely mindful of the risk, looked throught the peep first to see who it was, and only once I saw the guy standing a good distance away, cracked it to ask what he wanted.

Also make no mistake -- IT MADE NO DIFFERENCE whether I answered the door or not. Even if I had simply gone to the door, looked outside, not recognized the guy and refused to answer, it STILL would have been long enough for the other guy to enter the patio & steal my computer...

Bottom line is, you can't leave anything attended outside your house at night, even "just for a minute." A useful reminder...

[Jon McPhee]

Howard, having been burgled and car-broken-into myself, you've got my full empathy and condolences. Nothing quite like it when someone does something predatory and sneaky and violates one's sense of security and safety.

There's a lot of it going on in the world these days. Our state and federal legislatures, which look more and more like the front men for the gang of lobbyists and the special interests they fence for, have figured out that we can be suckered into answering the door to some distracting issue while they're carrying our tax money out the window. Kind of like the Mayor and Council were going to do with the Great Stadium Robbery.

Makes you wish you were standing in the shadows, watching and waiting, with a Glock in one hand and a Taser

[guy]

Mr Mott.
What I am saying is the Florida retired home owner is being buried in taxes.
A sales tax what ever the amount is the solution to spread the burden evenly. The sky is pretty cloudy over the whole state these days.

[guy]

Don't forget Don the Lottery was supposed to go to the schools only.

[Don Mott]

I understand your point guy but this thing is not economically feasible without it costing us more in the long run. As for the Lottery money, as far as I know it is going to education. The problem is when the Lottery money kicked in the legislature acted like the low lifes who stole Howard's computer and took the pre-existing education funds out the back door and used them elsewhere. In the meantime those clouds keep getting darker and darker.

[T Roach]

I'm new to the game (Nov 06) and I'm just amazed that Fl has three entities of legislation. One, of course, by the legislature, one by direct constitutional vote (with legislative blessing) and yet a third with this so-called 20-year tax reform commission. How in the world did it get to be so convoluted?

To save some finger time, who is St. Joe???

A small nuke attached to a trip wire should do the job. Hope you get 'em . . . . .

TR in the Cape

[Rich]

Don,

What happens to property tax receipts as home prices continue to go down? What about foreclosures? They collect less in property taxes. Same problem they would have with sales tax receipts in a downturn.

I would argue that Florida would see lower growth without property tax receipts because the governemnt would have no incentive to grow their tax base. Maybe then my tax dollars would go to my local schools and libraries not the new rural schools and libraries that are needed so the big developers can cash in.

Our government expects tax receipts to go up every year without fail. This is impossible as businesses and citizens profits and incomes rise and fall with the business cycle. They should save when times are good and cut expenses when times are tight just like the rest of us.

Sales taxes wouldn't cost us more in the long run if we set the rate and stuck to it. Force the government to stick to a realistic budget that is dependent on how well their citizens are doing.

I feel sorry for people who are going to lose their homes in part because the state of florida collects a ridiculous amount of property taxes from new homeowners. Shelter is a basic neccessity of life and should not be taxed below a certain dollar amount. Just as food and medicine aren't taxed.

At least if we collected sales taxes they could opt out(obviously they wouldn't pay any tax because they aren't buying anything). As it is our state government is basically forcing these people to pay taxes even if they lost a job, became seriously ill,etc.

[Rich]

Roach,

St Joe is the largest landowner in Florida. They are a publicly held company. This law is basically for them and all the other large landowners in the state. It will allow them to avoid paying taxes on the huge amounts of land they have until the market comes back and they can start selling agian.

[guy]

Those guy's that ripped off Howie the other night are probably students from our outstanding school system.

[Don Mott]

Hi Rich, I see your point as well but you are ignoring the huge lack of school funding this bill presents. As I said the legislature will be confronted with the task of making up the deficit in the school funds which will be substantial. Where do you think it will come from? You may save a little at first but you will pay in the long run. "Force the government to stick to a realistic budget that is dependent on how well their citizens are doing". Yeah good luck with that dream. I am sure you have been around long enough to realize our government operates not too much differently than a Ponzi scheme.

Fact of the matter is you're lucky you did open the door and not rush back to what you were doing. You spared yourself a potential physical confrontation that could have made this bad situation much worse. From one victim to another - replace everything which was taken ASAP and make yourself physically whole. You'll find the "woulda coulda shoulda" questions as well as the denial, anger, and depression all pass much faster.

[ENough]

I say stop cutting deals for the RICH and making us poor working stiffs pick up the slack. Every time I hear government is going to cut taxes, I know I'm going to pay for it somehow. This is government for the RICH, by the RICH. Screw the working class. AND stadiums/sports are our coliseums, to keep us distracted while the RICH pick our pockets and then tell us its all our fault. We get burgled everyday by corporate America. (Sorry Howard, but I can't help seeing the symbolism.) It is difficult to be vigilant while you got your brain wrapped around a ball. But then I think that all these corporate sporting events are mind-numbingly boring. Give me a camera and a walk in the park.

[T Roach]

Thanks Rich . . .